Euro 2004 Football discussion

[Asmo]

Tonight we have France vs. Greece.
Thoughts?
France should advance, but you never know, and Greece could surprise once more. Should be a good game.

Asmo

 

[OakwoodDM]

Wow for once the team that deserve to win, win the penality.

Congratulation Portugal you deserved it. When will the english learn that scoring a quick goal and playing the rest of the game in your goalie box will lead you nowhere against strong team. Taught they learned from their defeat with the french, guess not. too bad for you. I think that Figo should retires. things went much better once he was subbed. But got to say that Owen goal was something.

As for the BBC not seeing that the goalie was held down, I am not surprised.

I'm sorry, but it wasn't a deliberate idea to stay back and defend. We defended because we had no Rooney to drop back and pick up the ball in front of the midfield. Owen's a different type of striker. On top of that, the entire midfield was exhausted and Beckham felt he didn't need to put any effort in.
That lot combined with the ref turning in the most horribly biased display I've ever seen made it certain we wouldn't make it through.
And as the commentators said, there's no rule against using your arms to jump. Terry had no idea where the goalie was, he was just going for the ball. If the linesman with a clear view of the play gives the goal, the only reason (other than home team bias) for the unsighted ref a good 20 yards away to chalk it off is cowardice. He didn't have the guts to allow a last minute goal against the home team.
Well, at least England aren't the only ones to have seen their last action of the tournament last night. Once UEFA watches that match, the ref'll be on his way home.

 

[johnsemlak]

Tonight we have France vs. Greece.
Thoughts?
France should advance, but you never know, and Greece could surprise once more. Should be a good game.

Asmo

Well, anything can happen, but I really doubt Greece will overcome this obsticle. Their win against Portugal was against a nervous home side with a mountain of pressure on them not to screw up. Plus, the Greeks were considered (wrongly obviously) a non-threat at the time.

France are a battle-hardened team with a lot more talent than the Greeks, or the Portuguese, who have had a chance to observe Greece's matches from afar and will be ready for them.

 

[Lichtenhart]

And as the commentators said, there's no rule against using your arms to jump. Terry had no idea where the goalie was, he was just going for the ball.

There's no rule against using my arms to jump only if I don't touch anyone else. I can't punch you in the face and then say 'I was reaching for the ball.' and Campbell couldn't jump on Terry's shoulder to reach the ball. The referee (Meyer IIRC) has a solid 'tough but fair' reputation and I think he held true to that. He clearly saw a simulation in english area (by Nuno Valente IIRC) for what it was, where a biased one could have easily given the penalty.
Heck, I guess that if you say this match was the most biased you've ever seen, you haven't watched the last WC.
And I think Beckham played a match of great sacrifice. Cole was simply unpassable on the left side, but Portugal had a lot more play from the right. Both goals came from that side in fact, and Beckham often had to double in defense, which he did pretty well. Yes he failed the penalty. Can you really blame him that much, after 120' of running, with all the expectation he had upon him after failing the last time as well? Penalties are never a true test of a team's value.

 

[DarkMaster]

Terry had no idea where the goalie was, he was just going for the ball. If the linesman with a clear view of the play gives the goal, the only reason (other than home team bias) for the unsighted ref a good 20 yards away to chalk it off is cowardice. He didn't have the guts to allow a last minute goal against the home team.
Well, at least England aren't the only ones to have seen their last action of the tournament last night. Once UEFA watches that match, the ref'll be on his way home.

Ok, after the initial euphory, my head is a bit cooler this morning . If I remember correctly the one holding down wasn't the one who scored and the ref called it before it was actually put in. One thing that I didn't like on the BBC (I actually watched the game on the BBC, love the commentator's way) At some point Portugal seemed to have scored and England quickly counterattacked, they never showed a single replay of that action. Probably there was no goal but not a single replay, why?

Yesterday's game is one of the best I've seen in years. That was the first game my son watched (not the entire game he got distracted at some point) and I hope that it will help him get hooked to the sport. Has an half Portuguese half French his first Euro should be interesting .

Seriously this game could have been the final of the Euro, the only other potential contender left in my opinion are the Czech. As for France unless they get their act together I don't see them winning against a motivated team like Portugal, the Czech or even the Danish.

Probably a victory for France tonight but that should be it, I don't feel they have the determination required to continue, very sad.

One last thing after seeing all these Real Madrid all star in action lately, I don't even question why they were beaten by Monaco.

 

[DarkMaster]

I agree about penality not being a true test of Value. I hate game that end with penality, and I agree that after 120' minute you can miss them, but they are professional player and they are expected to perform. Penality are a test of will more than anything else, most of the other penality shooter had run 120' and they were able to put it in. Why did Beckham the "expert" missed? To much time working on his image, too much money to care don't know but in my opinion he lack determination and strong will.

I agree with you on the WC. The refering made me puke, I remember that Spain-Corea game...

 

[Lichtenhart]

Heh, if there was a clear recipt on how to get strong will, the whole world, could be better, not only soccer.

And about the replay on that action, not the BBC's fault. Every television broadcasts what the portuguese TV transmits. I didn't see them as well, and I would have liked.

I remember Spain laughing at us when Corea won vs Italy, and we complained about the referee. Then they played with Corea as well, and didn't laugh anymore.

 

[OakwoodDM]

There's no rule against using my arms to jump only if I don't touch anyone else. I can't punch you in the face and then say 'I was reaching for the ball.' and Campbell couldn't jump on Terry's shoulder to reach the ball. The referee (Meyer IIRC) has a solid 'tough but fair' reputation and I think he held true to that. He clearly saw a simulation in english area (by Nuno Valente IIRC) for what it was, where a biased one could have easily given the penalty..

So you're saying that every time someone jumps for the ball and touches someone else there should be a free kick? Well, that would make a very stop start game. Nearly every header won has contact. And Campbell didn't jump on Terry's shoulder. The free kick was given because the goalie couldn't get to the ball before Campbell, due to the fact that Terry was jumping in between them.
Tough but fair? Did you see him give a free kick against Rooney for being stood on? or Vassell every time he got near the ball? There was no way that performance could be described as fair by anyone other than a Portugal supporter (or an England hater). I just re-read this bit and thought I should point out I'm not accusing you of anything, just having watched the match, can't understand how you felt his decisions were fair.

Heck, I guess that if you say this match was the most biased you've ever seen, you haven't watched the last WC.
And I think Beckham played a match of great sacrifice. Cole was simply unpassable on the left side, but Portugal had a lot more play from the right. Both goals came from that side in fact, and Beckham often had to double in defense, which he did pretty well. Yes he failed the penalty. Can you really blame him that much, after 120' of running, with all the expectation he had upon him after failing the last time as well? Penalties are never a true test of a team's value.

No, I didn't see any of the Korea matches in the last world cup. Unfortunately, IIRC, they were all on in the middle of the night here, and I rated sleep more important!
As for Beckham running for 120 mins? I don't recall him running for more than a second at a time. No-one on the pitch was really running hard, but he walked through the whole match, and his idea of defence was to stand 5 yards away from the player and hope he would be intimidated. And the reason both goals came from the right was because he and Neville failed. If he had defended well, they wouldn't have come.

I totally agree about penalties, though. I hate them but there really isn't any other way I can think of to decide draws in such tightly scheduled tournaments (short of counting corners or possession or something).

 

[OakwoodDM]

Why did Beckham the "expert" missed? To much time working on his image, too much money to care don't know but in my opinion he lack determination and strong will.

That's true, but I'm sure being the first person to use that sand pit of a penalty spot can't have helped. Can anyone explain to me why after it became clear that it was an awful spot they didn't try the other end? I mean, if they had done it after each team had had the same number of penalties, no-one would have been disadvantaged, and it couldn't have made it worse!

 

[DarkMaster]

Does anyone knows why the Golden goal rule was removed. I would have prefer to see Portugal win with a golden goal then on the penality shootout.