D&D 5E Experience with a bladesinger?

[Sacrosanct]

Curious, has anyone had any experience playing the Bladesinger arcane tradition? On the surface, it seems to be a very risky proposition: a wizard standing in front line melee

My assumptions (which could be totally off):

* light armor and a decent DEX and good INT gives you an AC of around 18 (plus 5 for shield reaction). So really good AC to help really low HP
* cantrips give extra damage in addition to your normal attack rolls, putting you up there with other melee PCs
* better benefits at level 10 and higher, but I don't count those too much because that's a ways off, and a whole lot of gaming time will be before then.
* I worry save damage spells as opposed to attacking spells would be pretty devastating since HP are pretty low.

So without multiclassing, how well has it worked? Does anyone have any experience?

 

[Diamabel]

Curious, has anyone had any experience playing the Bladesinger arcane tradition? On the surface, it seems to be a very risky proposition: a wizard standing in front line melee

My assumptions (which could be totally off):

* light armor and a decent DEX and good INT gives you an AC of around 18 (plus 5 for shield reaction). So really good AC to help really low HP
* cantrips give extra damage in addition to your normal attack rolls, putting you up there with other melee PCs
* better benefits at level 10 and higher, but I don't count those too much because that's a ways off, and a whole lot of gaming time will be before then.
* I worry save damage spells as opposed to attacking spells would be pretty devastating since HP are pretty low.

So without multiclassing, how well has it worked? Does anyone have any experience?

My thoughts so far:
-"Melee" cantrips are a total Nonbo with bladesinger's extra attack feature, since you can only cantrip attack *or* attack twice. Extra attack is usually a wasted class feature.
-Low damage scaling- bladesinger gets defensive buff after defensive buff, but little in the way of extra offense (if played as a melee wizard)
-overall it plays best like a normal, ranged casting wizard, with the ability to "turn on" a massive defense+mobility buff in bladesong if enemies get close.

I think they missed the mark, if the mark was to have a character that seamlessly combined melee and magic into a cohesive whole.

 

[Sacrosanct]

So would you say the eldritch knight is the "mostly in combat with some spell augments" and the bladesinger is "mostly ranged caster, with some melee combat augments"?

 

[Diamabel]

So would you say the eldritch knight is the "mostly in combat with some spell augments" and the bladesinger is "mostly ranged caster, with some melee combat augments"?

That seems to be what each is best suited for, IMO.

 

[CapnZapp]

Yes, they realized melee was risky and so they buffed the Bladesinger's defenses...

...but they forgot to add any carrots (or whips) to have the Bladesinger actually enter melee!

The result is a Wizard that's excellent at spellcasting (as good as any other Wizard that isn't using any particular Tradition tricks) and why would one ever want to enter melee?

Any Bladesinger must be almost as good as a Fighter in melee (to actually do it) and significantly worse than a Wizard at regular spell-chucking (to make melee the rational choice).

This Bladesinger already exist. It's called Eldritch Knight.

 

[CapnZapp]

So would you say the eldritch knight is the "mostly in combat with some spell augments" and the bladesinger is "mostly ranged caster, with some melee combat augments"?

I'd say no, not melee combat augments - melee survival augments.

Big difference. You never want to stay in melee using your half-baked melee combat abilities if the alternative is falling back to unleash full Wizard spellcasting hell on your foes.

Maybe if the Bladesinger said "max 30 foot range" to ALL your spells...

 

[Xeviat]

The bladesinger should have gotten the Eldritch Knight's "War Magic" feature, not the "Extra Attack" feature. Combat casters either get buffed cantrips (add ability mod) or Extra Attack, but Extra attack isn't very good on them.

 

[Sacrosanct]

That seems to be what each is best suited for, IMO.

This is based on your experience playing them?

I'd say no, not melee combat augments - melee survival augments.

Big difference. You never want to stay in melee using your half-baked melee combat abilities if the alternative is falling back to unleash full Wizard spellcasting hell on your foes.

Maybe if the Bladesinger said "max 30 foot range" to ALL your spells...

Is this from your experience as well?


I'm not really interested in "This is how I'm guessing it's played" because if there's one thing about 5e, it's that theorycrafting never does it justice or represents how the class is actually played. The background of a bladesinger (and history of that class going back to 2e) is one where the PC is in melee most of the time, with spells to augment it. I'm curious to know if in actual play, the class can't support that well.

 

[Ralif Redhammer]

There’s a Bladesinger in my gaming group, but he hasn’t gotten to 3rd level yet, so it’s not quite the full experience. He seems fine, if a little squishy.

Personally, I don’t care for the Bladesinger subclass, but I also tend not to play wizards, either, for what it’s worth.

 

[Mephista]

I find that the bladesinger is absolutely fine in melee. Haste, some defensive spells, and a magic weapon, and we're dealing fine with melee. The main problem comes in the form of a lack of weapon damage - there are only three wizard spells that increase melee damage, not counting the new cantrips. They are Haste, Fire Shield and Magic Weapon, the latter of which is redundant with an actual magic weapon.

My GM is pretty light on the Concentration saves, which is probably a factor, and the tactics are a bit repetative, but I'm doing decent damage with my three attacks / turn. Its not an optimized Great Weapon Master with accuracy fishing, but it works.