Fellow player fudging rolls

[CuRoi]

As a DM I've seen players fudge rolls on numerous occassions. Usually it is not a problem - you know, a very infrequent intentional or even unintentional flub. I just let it slide. Life's too short for me to get worked up about it.

However, recently I was playing with a new group and noticed one player was consistently rolling "too well". I wasn't DMing at the time, couldn't see his rolls and I just chalked it up to luck - no one else seemed to care.

Next, I DMed a game with this same guy. Then the cheating really got out of hand. So much so that he started alienating other players with it. He constantly insisted on rolling untrained skill checks and nearly every time his roll would somehow bury the trained PCs (it was a low level start.) So I started requiring a "task leader" for all skill checks and any other rolls were just considered an "aid another" not a competitive roll.

I tried to indirectly mention this in my weekly email updates to the players. That worked for about 1 session as the guys dice suddenly "cooled off". But game after that he was back on it.

I began to see a pattern and so I stopped giving him DCs prior to the roll (because he often wanted his roll to sound "just good enough" but not "too good".) I also devised skill checks which required multiple success in a row just for his PC, which made cheating discreetly more difficult.

I also compeltely stopped giving his PCs any benefit of the doubt when it came to MY dice rolls. Normally, while trying to kill the players, I'm secretly rooting for them and I may occassionally fudge some dice for them. I didn't target him mind you, but I held absolutely nothing back on the guy. He was always charging into situaitons (playing party hero and assuming his fakery would save him) and I made sure he knew he was in over his head every time.

Besides that, I didn't try much else because I no longer game with that individual and I knew I was going to be parting company pretty soon anyway for a multitude of reasons.

Long story short - your DM has probably noticed. If you feel uncomfortable dealing with the guy, mention it to the DM. He may have some ideas on how to deal with it. At the very least he can just say all rolls need to be out at the table's center.

 

[Traveon Wyvernspur]

I'd talk to him personally and in a non-confrontational manner. If he keeps it up, I tell the DM about it and let him handle it.

To me, half the fun of the game is the roll of the dice and getting those rare 1's and 20's, it is what makes the game exciting. Why even roll at all if you hit "every time" by always cheating the roll. It takes half the fun out of the game and removes the suspense.

As a DM I'd have him roll openly so that everyone could see. To me only the DM should be the one able to fudge rolls and hide them behind a screen. I've fudged rolls as a DM in the past where I felt it was appropriate and to keep my players alive if I think it was needed, but that's a DM's discretion.

 

[Stormonu]

I have had past issues with cheating players before, and few people seem to be comfortable confronting the individual. Personally, I'd try to catch the DM when the problem player isn't around and mention what is going on from there. The DM can then decide how best he wants to handle it, though he may want your assisting in detecting and preventing the cheating.

 

[Plane Sailing]

Both as a DM and a player I prefer the 'roll the dice in the open, and leave it so everyone can see" approach.

When a DM I've sometimes had to correct people who say "I've rolled my next five death saves in preparation (to which I reply 'no, you roll them when they are called for) or people who roll the dice, scoop them up and announce the roll.

Occasionally I would challenge someone who rolled low and got a high number to clarify the bonuses which ended up adding so much. Sometimes they were legitimate, sometimes they were overzealous.

 

[wedgeski]

When a DM I've sometimes had to correct people who say "I've rolled my next five death saves in preparation (to which I reply 'no, you roll them when they are called for) or people who roll the dice, scoop them up and announce the roll.

Yes this is about the extent to which I've had it at my table. It's not "cheating" so much as "trying it on". Someone tosses a d20 onto the table, it drops on a 20 and they say, "I'm keeping that for my next roll!"... and I have to politely inform them that they are mistaken.

 

[Janx]

I agree its no fun to play with a habitual cheater. Especially when it comes at the expense of making others look worse.

In the times I've cheated, I was much younger, and it was life or death, and it didn't seem to hurt anybody (and in fact helped the party).

One specific time, the BBEG was killing the party, and I was the last to roll an attack before the BBEG was going to start killing PCs. I rolled a miss. The GM was still taking notes. Everybody else was silent. I can't remember if it was me or my neighbor, but a finger went out and poked the die. It turned to 20 and the table cheered as I critted the BBEG, killing him, and saving the party.

I'd say I had party approval. the victory was memorable as us vs. the GM, not as "my PC saved the day" All the players knew what happened, was that we narrowly avoided a TPK becuase the GM wasn't paying attention.

Personally, i roll out in the open, and wait to roll until its really my turn.

I don't like cheating (though i don't mind tricking the DM). I don't like PCs who are "everywhere" or "always hitting despite the odds" as it tends to make me look like a putz compared to that PC.

I agree that sarcasm and such won't fix it. If you want it fixed, being straightforward and calm is probably the fairest approach. He may get huffy and quit, but like the cheating, that's his disfunction, not yours. Its also best to consider keeping it between you and him, or the GM and him. If you want him to change, he's got to be able to save face. Make him look bad in front of the group, and you challenge his ego. Despite the fact that the situation is all his fault.

I suppose the least confrontational method is for the DM to institute an open rolling in the Dice Pit rule. Meaning all rolls happen in the box in the center of the table. You can claim its to reduce the amount of runaway dice (I have some friends who can't seem to keep their rolls on the table

At my table:
cocked dice don't count (reroll)
floor dice don't count (reroll)
rolls have to be in the open for players
GM reserves right to do his rolls private (as some should be)

 

[Traveon Wyvernspur]

[MENTION=8835]Janx[/MENTION] funny story with the DM not paying attention and the other players being in on it. A few weeks ago I kept rolling 20's as the DM on my poor PCs and they took it upon themselves when I left the table for a moment to steal those two dice that were constantly hitting the 20's, we shared a good laugh about it.

I agree that rolling in the open should be pretty much a rule that all PCs follow and only the DM should have the right to roll privately as well as only rolling on your turn, cocked dice not counting, and dice that hit the ground not counting. Good points all.

 

[Piratecat]

Not true. When I was much younger, I cheated my ass off in D&D. That stopped a long, long time ago.

My 1e character stats of 18/99 18 18 17 18 16 were TOTALLY LEGIT! Honest!

 

[lud]

You could bring a dice tray to the game after obtaining approval from the GM.

If only rolls inside the tray count, then it solves a lot of dice cheating issues, abusive pre-rolling, etc...

You can place the tray close to the GM, who can read the result then give back the dice to the players once the results of the roll is figured. Outrageous modifier on a dice rolls are also more obvious this way!

It then becomes a tool for the GM to pace the action.

Also if you are playing with mini or tokens on a map, it's much safer to roll in a tray.

 

[Herremann the Wise]

A slightly different idea:

- Use a notepad thats only function is writing down his d20 results. Don't announce anything but just do it at the table.
- If he notices you doing this, he might feel pressure to desist.
- If he actually asks "what the hell are you doing", laugh and say you want to steal his d20.

No accusations or anything.

A player will generally only cheat if they think they are not being watched or that they can get away with it.

Or perhaps you can tell one of the other players to watch his rolls and let them confront him if you do not wish to.

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise