Fighter subclasses for every ability score

Blue

Orcus on a bad hair day
Hey, one thing the Fighter is definitely missing is non-combat and ribbon options. What do we give the various subclasses to round them out?
 

ART!

Explorer
You know, inching in on the territory of the Barbarian, Bard, monk, paladin, and ranger might be okay, as an option for people who want to play an archetype that leans that way but without the magic.
I am ALL IN on this. For instance, I'm a big fan of the spell-less ranger variants out there.

I don't feel like a STR/dex melee concept lends itself to an archetype, though. Those archetypes feel better served by the Rogue. I'm seeing a fast striking melee warrior, someone who lacks the weapon master's artful techniques and focus, but that isn't screaming a character to me, just a mechanic. Unless "warrior" feels like an archetype separate from a big brute.
I can see a STR-based fighter who hits less often but does lots more damage per hit, and a DEX-based fighter who does less damage per hit but can go for more (and different types of) attacks per round.


Actually a Guard - who's actually good at his job for the first time in D&D history - would be a possibility. A sniper also makes sense - about calm, deliberate attacks and spotting targets.
I'm reminded of Clint Eastwood's character in Unforgiven, Will Munney, talking about the quick-draw gunfighter who shot himself in the foot or something because he was in too big a hurry. He goes on to say how the quickest draws usually lost a gunfight to the slower, more careful sure-shots.

It is interesting how Action Surge and Extra Attack 3 and 4 really do lock the fighter in to a specific play style. The fighter could have been better suited with bigger subclasses and a little less on the core chasis, hu?
Would it work to have an option where a fighter has a choice to pick another action OR an extra dice of damage per attack, or something like that, either making that choice at the level that feature gets added, or on a turn-by-turn basis?
 

ART!

Explorer
Maybe someone has mentioned this already, but it occurs to me that you could do this with other classes, too. What's a STR-based wizard like? An INT-based Paladin? A DEX-based Cleric?
 
it occurs to me that you could do this with other classes, too.
Sure, if a fighter can do it, clearly everyone should be able to do it. Check me out, I'm an INT-based Commoner, I work for Realmsoft.

What's a STR-based wizard like?
Ogg very proud he invent magic, but get very tired of carrying huge stone tablets everywhere.

An INT-based Paladin?
"I Theologize him to death!"

A DEX-based Cleric?
A temple dancer.
 
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Blue

Orcus on a bad hair day
Maybe someone has mentioned this already, but it occurs to me that you could do this with other classes, too. What's a STR-based wizard like? An INT-based Paladin? A DEX-based Cleric?
Absolutely. Though with how wonderfully "wide" the responses were here, in some of the more crowded design spaces it might be better to break out of specific classes for a more general "If there was a "Arcane Caster" base class, what would it be if CON was it's secondary ability score. How does that differ if it's WIS, or DEX, or ...
 

Xeviat

Explorer
I still feel like too much of the discussion here is starting with the mechanics. That's why champion and battle master were bland: they lacked character. Rather than starting with a mechanic, why don't we pitch what these fighters are first.
 

Xeviat

Explorer
Hey, one thing the Fighter is definitely missing is non-combat and ribbon options. What do we give the various subclasses to round them out?

All fighter subclasses should have a nice ribbon at 3rd level that supports their story.
 

Garthanos

Arcadian Knight
I struggled with a strong concept for WIS. Are these so close that maybe it should be a single subclass that can trigger of INT or WIS for it's features?
Wis as being steady perceptive it reacts more but does so by being aware and it might take longer on its attack for some benefit? I think of Int as being quick predictive thinking instead of reacting to an already occurring situation but it is highly analytical and preplanning too hmmmmm .

So yeah there may be difficulty differentiating them in anything but a flavor fashion..

I was thinking in 4e that most of the powers and feats with Figher Wisdom riders ended up being the same ones I would Tweak via a combat style into being Intelligence riders.
 

Garthanos

Arcadian Knight
I couldn't decide if this was Wisdom or Intelligence secondary... decided intelligence as its so much about predicting and analysing but could be either.

[video=youtube;BGCMfprPJoA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGCMfprPJoA[/video]
 

ART!

Explorer
Wis as being steady perceptive it reacts more but does so by being aware and it might take longer on its attack for some benefit? I think of Int as being quick predictive thinking instead of reacting to an already occurring situation but it is highly analytical and preplanning too hmmmmm .

So yeah there may be difficulty differentiating them in anything but a flavor fashion..

I was thinking in 4e that most of the powers and feats with Figher Wisdom riders ended up being the same ones I would Tweak via a combat style into being Intelligence riders.
Just quickly looking at D&D Beyond's version of the PHB, INT measures mental acuity*, information recall, and analytical skill. WIS measures awareness, intuition, and insight.

*"sharpness or keenness of thought, vision, or hearing", says Google's dictionary

I couldn't decide if this was Wisdom or Intelligence secondary... decided intelligence as its so much about predicting and analysing but could be either.
[awesome scene of RDJ as Holmes in a fist fight]
Excellent example. Compare this to the more intuitive, instinctive, insightful approach your standard martial arts film protagonist might have. [insert great example here]

What would the functional, game-play difference be, in 5E?

Off the top of my head, I'd let the INT fighter make a lot of Investigation checks or somesuch, for weak spots, vulnerabilities, etc., and let the WIS fighter make Insight checks to predict their opponents next moves.
 
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Off the top of my head, I'd let the INT fighter make a lot of Investigation checks or somesuch, for weak spots, vulnerabilities, etc., .
Could be knowledge checks, too. And a 'right tool for the job' ethos, with specialized variations on weapons specific to a foe he expects to face...
 

Garthanos

Arcadian Knight
Off the top of my head, I'd let the INT fighter make a lot of Investigation checks or somesuch, for weak spots, vulnerabilities, etc., and let the WIS fighter make Insight checks to predict their opponents next moves.
I had an idea of using checks to enable maneuvers you forfeit an attack from your attack action to effectively have another superiority die for your next attack..... basically with the die as a damage boost on the next action its putting all your eggs in one basket with interesting effect being one of them. The skill check might not even be a hard one (or if it was add the WIS or INT or CHA also to the attack) or some similar stuff.
 

Garthanos

Arcadian Knight
The intelligent fighter I ran into is the scientist flavored fighter... of Thibault and Destreza fame from history. Its an unarmored fencing style

"It was the belief of both Carranza and Narvaez, as well as all of the subsequent masters of the Spanish School, that science, which is irrefutable, can and must be applied to swordsmanship. Their aim was to use science to improve the art of the sword,thus proving the validity, effectiveness, and perfection of their system. The definition of science must be taken into account before continuing. Science is knowledge, as of general truths or particular facts, obtained and shown to be correct by accurate observation and thinking. The science of geometry is the best manner in which "La Destreza" can be set forth because it is incontestable, being demonstrated to be exact by proofs." ....
 

Garthanos

Arcadian Knight
They were particularly effective at winning their fights without being significantly harmed in an era in which this just wasn't normal and seen as extraordinarily intimidating in their calm cool approach ... and to me it very much feels much more like a fighter than a rogue.
 

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