Shadowdark Finally Played Shadowdark

[Micah Sweet]

The problem is that there's nothing to tell them that they're not following the rules or that they're being bad GMs. Because when you follow the rules as written, everyone dies. It's the soft skills as a player and GM that could make it survivable - and those aren't covered.
It's as if there's this secret "you must learn the craft of GMing with an unbroken lineage back to Dave Arneson or you don't know how to run this system." In short, it's "gate-keepy."
It's bad design to assume that every GM will magically "know" how to run this system instead of creating a system with the design expectations that are robust enough to handle it.
If you're Arcane Library - you shouldn't create convention adventures like that. You also shouldn't presume compatibility with B/X D&D if it doesn't work.
Instead of having pages of random charts, level titles, and other pointless information there for nostalgia's sake, include some better GM guidance.

You say all these as if it should be obvious to anyone that any game designed this way is doomed to be a failure. At this point, I think it is pretty clear that's not the case for SD.

 

[Retreater]

With a +4, are you not looking at at least 70%?

Seems correct - assuming you get to the +4. My character did not because I didn't get to make my own character.

For my preferences, having a failed casting roll result in a fizzled spell is enough punishment instead of taking the spell for the rest of the day. If you want to be hardcore, maybe put in some HP loss. Like, a spell not working can be devastating. A feather fall spell that doesn't work can be instant death.

If you're playing a 2-hour convention game with funny death scenes, sure. If it's a months-long campaign, that's a big no from me.

 

[Scribe]

Seems correct - assuming you get to the +4. My character did not because I didn't get to make my own character.

Seems you were handed a lemon, by GM's who didn't even know how to run the game.

EDIT: Yeah I just checked the 'premade' Wizard which Arcane Library provides for its quick start.

Int: 18 (16 + 2 from Talent)

So yeah.

 

[Retreater]

You say all these as if it should be obvious to anyone that any game designed this way is doomed to be a failure. At this point, I think it is pretty clear that's not the case for SD.

You're conflating bad design and not being financially successful. I don't deny SD's popularity or financial success. However, I do think it's badly designed - not just for my interests, but in actually achieving the style of game it purports to want.
That's because you can't run Shadowdark with Shadowdark alone. You need additional books to teach best practices. You need to read things like the Old School Primer, Principia Apocrypha.
Using the rules in the game, it's TPK after TPK. Using the adventures as written by Arcane Library, it's TPK after TPK. You have to house rule ... a lot.

 

[Scribe]

That's because you can't run Shadowdark with Shadowdark alone.

No dude, this is false its honestly not that hard at all.

 

[Arilyn]

Shadowdark sums up the principles of modern OSR really well.

 

[Micah Sweet]

You're conflating bad design and not being financially successful. I don't deny SD's popularity or financial success. However, I do think it's badly designed - not just for my interests, but in actually achieving the style of game it purports to want.
That's because you can't run Shadowdark with Shadowdark alone. You need additional books to teach best practices. You need to read things like the Old School Primer, Principia Apocrypha.
Using the rules in the game, it's TPK after TPK. Using the adventures as written by Arcane Library, it's TPK after TPK. You have to house rule ... a lot.

Do you really think everyone who's run SD without a solid grounding in the texts you mentioned has suffered "TPK after TPK"? Do you believe your personal experience with the game is "that" universal?