Fire Seeds Stacking?

[Scion]

If you are that worried about the sheer damage of it (and who wouldnt be) then I would suggest that you definately give one save for each berry one is exposed to (which I believe is how it is in the raw anyway) but also if the target saves against any then consider the save made for all that they are hit with in that burst.

This would make spreading them out over several attacks better for overall damage, but for hitting a single target for a massive amount it would be much more difficult. Sounds like a tradeoff everyone can live with

 

[Gaiden]

If you are that worried about the sheer damage of it (and who wouldnt be) then I would suggest that you definately give one save for each berry one is exposed to (which I believe is how it is in the raw anyway) but also if the target saves against any then consider the save made for all that they are hit with in that burst.

This would make spreading them out over several attacks better for overall damage, but for hitting a single target for a massive amount it would be much more difficult. Sounds like a tradeoff everyone can live with

Not a bad suggestion if I was overly concerned with taking that type of damage. However, it is not fire seeds specifically that I am afraid of - my DM does not trade for tat in that sense. Rather than being vindictive he merely says: "The kid gloves are off".



As far as I am aware, there are no druids or other clerics with access to the Sun domain for us to worry about anyway. Instead, it is just how rules savy he will play the NPC's. For example, you could have a 15th level wizard who could have quicken spell, delay spell, scry, fly, teleport without error, and greater invisibility and just scry on someone in the party to get their location, teleport in invisibly, cast some delayed fire balls or delayed lightning bolts and quickened delayed magic missiles (quicken only costs +3 in our game) and then let loose with some 8th level spell of devastation plus another nasty quickened spell. In one round this is going to be a ridiculous amount of damage that probably only the monk could survive and only if she made all the saves. This is just one example and an easy one at that of an enemy behaving smartly but ruthlessly. My DM has not done this yet, but if we start opening the door to those types of tactics it is only fair that the opponents would respond in kind.

 

[Scion]

I hope that a single casting of nearly the only use for a spell isnt considered 'opening the door to over the top tactics'.

Even then though, at these levels the tactic you described will hopefully never work anyway. Whereas the fireseeds is simply a spell, put it in a sack and toss it around hours later.

So long as everyone is having fun it is cool, but no need for the dm to go insane when a single spell is cast

 

[Darklone]

Usually I don't worry too much about the spell since the deposition of the berries somewhere is a little problem by itself...

 

[Bill Muench]

Usually I don't worry too much about the spell since the deposition of the berries somewhere is a little problem by itself...

Not really. This particular tactic is a favorite of myself and one of my friends. We basically have two uses for it:

1. His druid casts Resist Energy (Fire) on my thug, granting him resistance 30 to fire. He then casts Fire Seeds and gives me the berry bombs. When I'm near someone he wants to blow up, he says the command word and sets them off. Since each berry is a separate instance of damage, the resistance applies to each one. The most damage he can do is 22 points per berry (he's currently 14th level), so I'm immune to the damage even if I fail all my saves.

2. The other tactic is pretty straight forward. My other character, a cleric with the Sun Domain, casts Energy Immunity (fire) every morning. When I think we're getting near a combat, I cast Fire Seeds. As a combat cleric, I'm usually up front. When an opportunity presents itself (2-3 opponents clumped up near me), I pull out the berries and set them off, immolating myself and my opponents. Since I'm immune, no big deal.

There are some downsides to this tactic. First, even resistance to fire 5 really drops the damage since it applies 8 times. So you have to pick your targets carefully. Second, casting it ahead of time doesn't always pay off and sometimes the spell is wasted ("So, Hosedarmah... why'd your pocket just explode?"). Finally, some DMs may just think it is too powerful. I'm not one of them, but some do.

 

[Gaiden]

I hope that a single casting of nearly the only use for a spell isnt considered 'opening the door to over the top tactics'.

Even then though, at these levels the tactic you described will hopefully never work anyway. Whereas the fireseeds is simply a spell, put it in a sack and toss it around hours later.

So long as everyone is having fun it is cool, but no need for the dm to go insane when a single spell is cast

I never mentioned him going insane . Actually, he took it all in stride (although the other player in the game was poo-ing bricks). Like I said, it wasn't that he had a problem with it (except for post game to make sure the ruling was right), rather it was just a significant step up from what we were used to.

 

[Scion]

I never mentioned him going insane .

Personally, I think that

...if we start opening the door to those types of tactics it is only fair that the opponents would respond in kind.
For example, you could have a 15th level wizard who could have quicken spell, delay spell, scry, fly, teleport without error, and greater invisibility and just scry on someone in the party to get their location, teleport in invisibly, cast some delayed fire balls or delayed lightning bolts and quickened delayed magic missiles (quicken only costs +3 in our game) and then let loose with some 8th level spell of devastation plus another nasty quickened spell.

qualifies

I know it was an example. However, 'taking the kids gloves off' when a single spell is used in a favorable fashion seems a bit odd. The spell might be a problem in and of itself but it isnt a justification for anything like that!

Happy gaming all

 

[SolidSnake]

Personally, I think that

But, you don't even know me!

I know it was an example. However, 'taking the kids gloves off' when a single spell is used in a favorable fashion seems a bit odd. The spell might be a problem in and of itself but it isnt a justification for anything like that!

Actually, I believe the phrase I used was: "It's on like DONKEY KONG!" I just love to taunt Gaiden when he makes good use of a spell. Personally, I thought it was brilliant, but it was late and I obviously missed something by forgetting to apply the stone giants fire resistance to each berry. I'm glad it made no difference and didn't detract from his accomplishment. I think that Gaiden is at the end of his rope with me and my borderline lethal encounters