D&D 5E Fixing the 5E Fighter, episode 47 - extra combat style at 5th level?

[phantomK9]

I'm of the opinion that the core Fighter should have access to Maneuvers and Superiority Dice, not just the Battle Master Archetype. I actually sat down and reworked the core Fighter progression a little bit, was easy to do. Basically give a couple of Superiority Dice and Maneuvers at second level and then another die and maneuver (or two) at the levels where the fighter would get the extra ASIs. The Battle Master would of course get more dice and his dice increase in die type.

Works fairly well.

 

[Tony Vargas]

I'm of the opinion that the core Fighter should have access to Maneuvers and Superiority Dice, not just the Battle Master Archetype. I actually sat down and reworked the core Fighter progression a little bit, was easy to do. Basically give a couple of Superiority Dice and Maneuvers at second level and then another die and maneuver (or two) at the levels where the fighter would get the extra ASIs. The Battle Master would of course get more dice and his dice increase in die type.

Works fairly well.

Leaves the battlemaster a little blah, though, doesn't it? Everfighter esle gets to pick the best maneuver or two and use it at what seems like the best time, while the battlemaster (like the high-level battlemaster currently) tries to make something of having the option of using a 6th-string maneuver or flogging a good maneuver for the nth time. Better, level-gated maneuvers for the Battlemaster have struck me as a good idea from the beginning: the problem, of course, is designing them.

 

[phantomK9]

Leaves the battlemaster a little blah, though, doesn't it?

That is a possibility. With the change I mentioned the Battle Master would basically be the "expert" in the Maneuvers/Superiority Dice, but it would still maintain all the other abilities that it has. Really this is more of an attempt to allow the Champion to "compete" with the Battle Master because I found the Champion quite lacking. Heck, even with the change, the Champion still seemed way behind as far as unique abilities went.

 

[Matrix Sorcica]

Seriously, though, every edition of D&D tries to bring the fighter up to snuff, and every edition fails.

Except 4e

 

[Tony Vargas]

Except 4e

Just failed by the smallest margin. ;P

 

[jgsugden]

If it ain't broke....

The 5E fighter is just fine. It is competitive with the other melee classes and outshines them at the highest levels.

 

[Helldritch]

Just make your fighter take a 2 level dip in ranger or paladin and he'll have his second style.
He will even have a few spells to boot. (Hunter's mark? Any of the smite? Shield of faith) to get either a small damage or defensive boost. (I'd go for the ranger as action surge could mean a few additionals d6.)

If you really don't want to go into multiclassing and really want more than one fighting style; then you are stuck with the champion. This means that you'll get your fighting style way further than 3rd level. (10th if I recall correctly).

That is why I would not do what the OP is considering. Fighting styles are really powerful. With level dips into an other class, you have to pay for your additional style with either a slower ASI or slower extra attack or even both! With the solution you are offering, there is no trade off. All characters have a weakness. With what you are proposing a fighter will no longuer have any weakness. I imagine a dual wielder with bow mastery and sharp shooter feat. Good in hand to hand, good at range combat too. No weaknesses whatsoever and as a fighter he'll have the hp to take the punishement other classes don't.

Nope, I would not accept many fighting styles without a heavy price attached to it. Fighters are fine as they are. And they are deadly.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

BTW As pointed out in a now-lost thread, one of the best uses of the Fighter's Action Surge is as an escape power.

4 attacks may be considered an escape power.

 

[Horwath]

Just make your fighter take a 2 level dip in ranger or paladin and he'll have his second style.
He will even have a few spells to boot. (Hunter's mark? Any of the smite? Shield of faith) to get either a small damage or defensive boost. (I'd go for the ranger as action surge could mean a few additionals d6.)

This.

Also if you do not like spells you can get spell-less ranger variant from UA.

Then go with champion fighter. It's like keeping your cake and eating it.

 

[One_Shots]

The fighter is already very powerful with battle master being one of the most powerful classes in the game. Giving them even more seems like overkill.