Fun stuff to do with illusions

[Nareau]

LokiDR, I have to respectfully disagree with your interpretations of "interaction" and "incontrovertible proof"
We consider "interaction" to be combat (where the illusion and the combatant don't make physical contact) or conversation. We also include other non-physical situations where the character acts upon the illusion, and the illusion has to react somehow.

We consider "incontrovertible proof" to be physical contact, or the illusion doing something really bizarre.

Try to blow out an illusory fire: Saving throw. You're acting on it, and it's having to react appropriately.

Stick your hand in illusory fire: Incontrovertible proof. Since the fire is incapable of burning you, you immediately know it's not real. You can feel that it's hot...but your flesh isn't burning away.

Swing at the illusory orc, and miss: Saving throw. There's just something funny about how it was able to dodge that blow...

Swing at the illusory orc, and hit: IP. Your sword went right through the thing! It can't be real.

Swing at the illusory wraith, and hit: ST. Wraiths are incorporeal, so it may just be that you can't hurt this thing.

Touch an illusory wall: IP. The illusion is not solid. Your hand passes right through it. It's obviously not real.

Examine an illusory wall: ST. By looking very closely at it, you may see some flaw in the illusion.

I'd also not let the illusion replicate a darkness spell, as it's not creating an "object, creature, or force." Not to mention that it would be pretty cheesy.

Nor would I allow you to "make a whole bunch of pits appear in the hallway behind you." Again, that's not an "object, creature, or force."

I do agree with you that the Image spells should be able to create multiple objects, creatures, or forces so long as they remain within the AoE.

Some of the things I've used illusions for:

Major Image: Fire Wall. I used it to carve a path through a river of swarming rats. Most of the rats didn't get a saving throw as they were just trying to escape the heat. Even the ones that did get saves failed them, as the DC was very high. Included in the effect were the sounds and smells of hundreds of burning rats.

Major Image: Ghostly Forest. I used it to illuminate the battlefield, slow down an enemy, and provide some concealment to my allies.

Major Image: Swarm of Angels. I used it to confuse and irritate a Roc that was attacking my friends.

I think illusions are great for the Sorcerer class.

 

[LokiDR]

LokiDR, I have to respectfully disagree with your interpretations of "interaction" and "incontrovertible proof"
We consider "interaction" to be combat (where the illusion and the combatant don't make physical contact) or conversation. We also include other non-physical situations where the character acts upon the illusion, and the illusion has to react somehow.

We consider "incontrovertible proof" to be physical contact, or the illusion doing something really bizarre.

Doing something really bizarre doesn't work well in world of magic. That wall rippled when you threw a rock at it? Might be a portal.

Combat is an interaction, and grappling is by definition combat. Circumstance bonuses would be in order, but in the middle of combat, things get hetic.

Try to blow out an illusory fire: Saving throw. You're acting on it, and it's having to react appropriately.

Agreed.

Stick your hand in illusory fire: Incontrovertible proof. Since the fire is incapable of burning you, you immediately know it's not real. You can feel that it's hot...but your flesh isn't burning away.

Agreed, after a full round of holding your hand in the fire.

Swing at the illusory orc, and miss: Saving throw. There's just something funny about how it was able to dodge that blow...

Agreed.

Swing at the illusory orc, and hit: IP. Your sword went right through the thing! It can't be real.

Disagree. If you see blood, you might think you cut through some soft flesh. Besides, you decide as the controler of the illussion what hits and what doesn't. Bad use of illusion gives circumstance bonuses.

Swing at the illusory wraith, and hit: ST. Wraiths are incorporeal, so it may just be that you can't hurt this thing.

Agreed.

Touch an illusory wall: IP. The illusion is not solid. Your hand passes right through it. It's obviously not real.

Agreed.

Examine an illusory wall: ST. By looking very closely at it, you may see some flaw in the illusion.

Agreed.

I'd also not let the illusion replicate a darkness spell, as it's not creating an "object, creature, or force." Not to mention that it would be pretty cheesy.

Darkness is as much a force as light. Illusions can stop line of sight, so I have no problem with this use.

Nor would I allow you to "make a whole bunch of pits appear in the hallway behind you." Again, that's not an "object, creature, or force."

Object: a hallway with pits. That is as much an object as a wall of a building.

I do agree with you that the Image spells should be able to create multiple objects, creatures, or forces so long as they remain within the AoE.

I wonder if there is an offical stance on that. But most people here have agreed to much the same.

Major Image: Fire Wall. I used it to carve a path through a river of swarming rats. Most of the rats didn't get a saving throw as they were just trying to escape the heat. Even the ones that did get saves failed them, as the DC was very high. Included in the effect were the sounds and smells of hundreds of burning rats.

You are violating your own definition. You said speach would provoke a save, so fealing heat also should. I agree with the way you played it though.

Major Image: Ghostly Forest. I used it to illuminate the battlefield, slow down an enemy, and provide some concealment to my allies.

Figments can not illuminate, strange as that seems. If you couldn't see before, you can't now. That would be part of the "real affects" part of the description of figments.

Major Image: Swarm of Angels. I used it to confuse and irritate a Roc that was attacking my friends.

Another good use. I used an Enrie to do much the same to a party.

 

[Kershek]

I don't think I can agree with the fact that Silent Image or their higher level counterparts can create multiple objects. Otherwise, you could create the illusion of a large force of fighters, which doesn't seem probable.

 

[LokiDR]

I don't think I can agree with the fact that Silent Image or their higher level counterparts can create multiple objects. Otherwise, you could create the illusion of a large force of fighters, which doesn't seem probable.

How is this more powerful than "summoning" a great demon? It is only a matter of style, and that shouldn't be a limiting factor.

 

[Kershek]

Because, I can then take those fighters and effectively tie up several dozen orcs that would otherwise be charging our position and attacking (I'm speaking of an upcoming event in a game I'm in where lots of orcs will be attacking, Helm's Deep style). That just seems too much for such a low level spell, especially since my 5th level Gnome Illusionist's save DC, depending on Fox's Cunning, can be upwards of DC 21 for a 1st level illusion spell. They'd basically have to roll a 20 to break off from attacking the illusions.

 

[LokiDR]

Which would stop a hord more effectively: A band of fighters or a 40 foot tall demon cloaked in fire?

If you want to create 40 fighters to tie up 40 orcs, just think about controling them. You can not concentrate on realistic movements for that many characters. It would tie them up for a few rounds, but circumstance penalties should keep that from happening for the entire combat. You should be able to tie up a number of creatures with low level spells, see web.

 

[Deset Gled]

A fun one I once used: a kobold (or some other weak creature) wearing armor with Continual Flame cast on it. The players thought they were fighting some kind of fire creature, and ended up working much harder than they actually had to. This idea was given to me by another poster around here, but I can't remember who.

Overall, I believe illusions work best when they combine with reality, rather than completely recreating it. That wall may look like it's 50 feet tall, but only needs to be 5 for a character to be able to lean on it and not fall through. There are also the previous examples of moving doors, placing false runes, etc.

 

[Sabaron]

Here's an idea that might work with just Silent Image: A massive army, covering the entire horizon. Of course, this army isn't AT the horizon, it's roughly 100' away from the target, positioned at horizon level, and with a nice distance haze effect on it. You'd probably have to practice it first, but what do you think?

 

[LokiDR]

Here's an idea that might work with just Silent Image: A massive army, covering the entire horizon. Of course, this army isn't AT the horizon, it's roughly 100' away from the target, positioned at horizon level, and with a nice distance haze effect on it. You'd probably have to practice it first, but what do you think?

You only have 4+lvl 10' cubes. At 100' away, that wouldn't cover much of the horizon.

That brings up an interesting question. Should there be any check to create an illusion with some sort of distortion, like this example, or create an illusion based on what you have seen (illusion of an army where you have only seen a few dozen men at arms)

 

[kenc]

illusion trick

hello all, new to the board and this is my first post <wave>

Anyway here is an old illusion that is very effective. Carry a bag with a skull in it. When in combat and over matched. Reach into the bag at the same time yelling to your party members to watch out. Then you pull out a meadusa's(sp) head. It is of coarse an illusion but with good acting it will be very believable.

Illusion spells are all about the acting and making the target of your illusion believe.