Gamers keeping Shabbat

Re: Re: Re: d20 Logo on Kippahs Update

Paladin said:
Well, it's kind of a different animal with the dice bags & kippahs. The license says that the license must be in every d20 product. That'll be really hard to do unless they let us put in a printed out on paper version. That's all I need him (or ANYONE who'll answer e-mail at WotC) to tell me. I can print out d20 licenses like crazy and send them out with every dice bag/kippah, but making them a permanent part of a dice bag is hard and would be nearly impossible on a kippah. :(

I'm sorry to hear that this has become such a pain in the neck, but your effort is sincerely appreciated. I revert back to my earlier question -- can you just make kippahs which depict a twenty-sided die, perhaps amid a few concentric circles or a Star of David?
 

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Re: Re: Re: Re: d20 Logo on Kippahs Update

Quickbeam said:


I'm sorry to hear that this has become such a pain in the neck, but your effort is sincerely appreciated. I revert back to my earlier question -- can you just make kippahs which depict a twenty-sided die, perhaps amid a few concentric circles or a Star of David?
Let's put it like this, if you can find a pic and e-mail it, as long as it is not copyrighted, we can stick it on there. We have become quite good at this actually. You would not believe some of the things that people request to put on a bag! Or, maybe you would, these are gamers after all!:D Paladinwife
 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: d20 Logo on Kippahs Update

Paladin said:

Let's put it like this, if you can find a pic and e-mail it, as long as it is not copyrighted, we can stick it on there. We have become quite good at this actually. You would not believe some of the things that people request to put on a bag! Or, maybe you would, these are gamers after all!:D Paladinwife

I'll work on it :).
 

HalWhitewyrm said:

Nope, I am Orthodox. The difference is that I am from the Spanish-Portuguese tradition, just one of the various Sephardic traditions. Some of the Sephardim are just as strict as chasidim, others aren't (like us). And I doubt that both an Orthodox Ashkenazim and an Orthodox Sepahrdim would agree with you that there is little difference between them (just ask my two rabbis, both Orthodox, one Sephardim and one Ashkenaz).

Edit: Spelling

They wouldn't because of the excrutiating detail that is inherant in Orthodoxy. However, the things that different Orthodoz groups argue over usually seem quite triial to everyone else. It is from that bigger picture prospective that I say thast they are pretty similar.
 


Just in time for Shabbat

Here is the reply I got from Eretz Hamdah, by way of ou.org......

-----

This is a somewhat difficult question to answer. You first ask about “compatible with Shabbat.” You then talk about “forbidden.” The latter is easier to answer. You can, as you describe, do things in a way which is not forbidden. However, there is a question of what is appropriate for Shabbat.
Shabbat is, on one hand, a day for physical relaxation and even indulgence. Thus, what makes a person feel happy, and is permitted, should be encouraged. On the other hand, Shabbat is a day where there should be spiritual elevation. This finds expression during the Shabbat davening, the zemirot during the meals, the practice that many who do not find time to attend Torah lectures during the week do so on Shabbat. Every person has to find a balance that works for him or her at their stage of life. In determining whether a certain activity is appropriate, one has to understand the person involved, the context, and the alternatives that exist.
Someone who realistically will not spend all day attending lectures or studying on his own can spend some time on board games. I have a little more reservation in giving a blessing to the type of activity you describe, because of the (admittedly not firmly based) impression that I get. That is that it appears that the getting together to play games which people tend to take very seriously creates an atmosphere where the highlight of the Shabbat is these games. The highlight should be the spiritual, the opportunity to spend the day with the family, etc. To the extent that these games cause one to lose the proper focus it is somewhat inappropriate.

To summarize, without knowing you, I cannot say anything definitive, as the matter of appropriate atmosphere is, realistically speaking, subjective. It is even possible that one should feel free to spend time on board games once in a while, but should be careful not to turn it into a Shabbat ritual.

Now, let us address the issue of the miniature forms. The Shulchan Aruch Yoreh Deah 141:4 writes “It is forbidden to draw the form of man…and if a non-Jew made them it is forbidden to own…when is this said, in reference to forms that stick out, but in imprinted forms it is permitted… and if they are for educational purposes they are permitted even if they are sticking out.” (Examples of sunken images are embroidery on a cloth or writing on a wall).

There are some that say that it is forbidden to make or own a 3 dimensional form of man even for decorative purposes (Shulchan Aruch ibid.), and there are others who say that the prohibition applies only to a whole body form and that a head is permitted (Shulchan Aruch ibid. 7).
Because the entire prohibition is derived from idol worship, and in our days there is minimal fear of idol worship, there are those who are lenient regarding human statues in homes.

One must also differentiate between set statues of people, which are forbidden, and movable forms, which are permitted because there is no fear of transgressing with them.
Regarding play dolls, which are not set images and not for decorative purposes, it is possible to be lenient and permit them to be formed and certainly to keep them after they have been made (Yechaveh Da’at 3:64).
The same should apply to little forms that are used as play pieces in a board game.
----
 

That was a good response. The OU group has some good rabbis in their midst. My personal feeling is precisely as he described it: gaming in and of itself is not bad, but it depends on how much emphasis you put on it. When it comes to roleplaying, I am one who gets into it, as do most other gamers I know. This can, in my personal case, intrude on the atmosphere of Shabbat in that it deters from the immersion I am already having on the day. So for me it is simply easier not to game on Shabbat (though board and card games are cool by me), and I am completely comfortable with that.

I'll just have to keep searching for weekday Cons, and to keep advocating for full-schedule Sundays at conventions, instead of the usual half-day schedules they normally offer.
Sheah, right, like that will happen. :)
 

my 0.02gp

HalWhitewyrm said:

I've never really felt it is said in a bad way, but rather a reference to the fact that most Christian religions do not have the number of rules that Judaism does (I say most because there are various Christian sects that do have their own share of rules, e.g. Seventh-Day Adventists, Baptists, etc.).
It's not a barb against Catholicism and/or Christianity.

Speaking as a life long Seventh-Day Adventist I don't take it personally, :) there are a decent amount of teachings, and for myself as someone mentioned above (sorry, I can't remember who) it's never really been much of a burden, what some would see as excessive rules I see more as senseible guidelines. and of course there are those congregations who are more liberal then others and some who are borderline on being rabid in their conservitism. (for myself I fall somewhere between, though on the conservitive side of the half way point)

Now to bring this post back onto the original topic. I don't game from sundown on Friday to sundown on Saturday/Sabbath. It's a personal choice that's worked well for me so far in life. At one point I was a member of a LARP group and during the 3 years that I played with them I was a hour or two late 4-5 months out of the year as the games were on Sat. night and I didn't show up till after sundown. I never hid why I wasn't going to be there on time and (when asked) answered questions when people had them. As evidenced by allot of the comments I've seen on this thread, my experience was that most times people will respect your belief's, and you for holding to them.

Drat, sorry for the post length there, didn't mean to rant,

-cnath.rm
 

Don't worry, cnath.rm, we're all glad to hear from you! :)

Oh, and on the kippah front, I've ordered eight (!) from Paladin - two or three for me, and the rest to be saved for future Chanukah gifts! :)
 

Which designs did you get, jut out of curiosty?
I'm waiting to stabilize a bit more after my recent move to a new apt. before ordering one or two (also hoping WotC will reply Paladin, though I think we have a better chance of hell freezing over).
 

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