Games you were turned off of and why

[francisca]

3.x

I started a game in 3.0, moved it to 3.5. Initially, it was just some of the changes that 3.5 implemented that annoyed me, then I jsut got tired of 3.X all together. In retrospect, I wish I would have just stuck with 3.0, and swiped a few things from 3.5 like the Harm fix (which I had houseruled already), but I would have tired of it eventually. 3.x and me as a DM are just not a good mix.

I also tired of Magic:tG after about 4 years. No desire to keep up with the flood of cards. Started to lose interest right after Urza's Saga.

 

[Psion]

Has anyone mentioned RIFTS yet? Yeah, wonky system, and difficult to GM.

Over The Edge - my first taste of rools lite gaming. And pretty much my last.

WEG SW - hate dice pools, hate that PCs are so chumpy compared to movie characters, hate that stormtrooper armor seems to matter , hate that the force and the dark side does not behave like the movies.

Rolemaster/spacemaster - My players always had to have me make their characters because they didn't get it. Then I got RMSS and I didn't get it...

GURPS - showed me that giving players a free hand is not always a good thing. Taught me to hate "point farm" style disads. Strange obsession with the power of guns.

 

[der_kluge]

I'm gonna go out on a limb here:

Paranoia. I've never understood the point. The one time I played it, my entire goal became "see how many times I can get killed". That made the game more enjoyable for me. I just don't get the point of this game. I hate it.

Chill - I remember it sucking. We only played it once, but I suspect a lot of that had to do with the GM.

 

[Imret]

Uh, there was only one GURPS book about Robin Hood, and frankly, it wasn't good enough to make a sequel. (It had crap like an outer space version of Robin Hood, a 17th century Scotland version of Robin Hood, Cyber-Robin ... you get the point.) I know you're referring to its decision to make extra supplements for Traveller and Transhuman Space and WWII (snip)

Errr...nope. I'm referring to the catalog I flipped through at my FLGS a few years back while looking for "something new".

OTOH, I might be thinking of Conan supplements. Maybe 2nd Edition. It was a while ago, but I remember thinking "There's like two and a half pages, two columns a page, in 8pt-font...just for GURPS? No, I don't think we'll be doing -that-".

 

[Imret]

I'm gonna go out on a limb here:

Paranoia. I've never understood the point.

Well, looking for a point in a Paranoia game is part of the problem. I think, more than any other system, it requires a very clever GM who gets the setting completely. I know a couple of my top ten most favorite gaming sessions were Paranoia, and I know the one time I ran it I swore never to do that to such a fine game ever again.

It's been about ten years, so I keep thinking I should try again.

And read the Ultra-Violet Clearance section ALL the way through.

 

[Gothmog]

Don't mean to take it off topic and you are entitled to your views and opinions, but you found d6 Star Wars clunky? I am working off the assumption given that you post here that you at least on occasion play D&D 3.x or a d20 game of some sort. You enjoy these games and their rules mechanics but found the d6 system clunky? Roll your skill, add the dice beat the target number and you succeed is clunky? If the GM said it was a difficult task you would have to make the "Difficult" target number? Categories were Very Easy, Easy, Moderate, Difficult, Very Difficult, and Heroic and you found that clunky? Combat was roll to hit vs. roll to not get hit and if you hit roll the damage dice, they roll to soak. That is the hardest part.

Don't see it, sorry.

Yep, I've played quite a bit of D6 system and D20. They are clunky in different ways.

D20 is clunky due to the rules bulge and the extreme (sometimes excrucating) detail that must be taken to prep a game. I've gotten to the point I'll play D20, but I won't run it again until I've had some time to detox.

D6 is clunky not due to complexity, but due to mathematical probabilities and how it runs in play. It gives even wonkier results than many dice pool systems I've played in, largely due to the wild die. A 1 in 6 chance of extreme success or 1 in 6 of failure is WAY too high of odds and variability in the system. As a player, I found it hard to have a decent grasp of my chances of success in the system, and as a result it detracted a lot of the fun from the game to me because of the extreme randomness. Also, D6 Star Wars characters felt like chumps a lot of the time, unless you were a Jedi. In that case the Jedi character did everything and the other players sat back and occasionally contributed a technical skill roll.

 

[harmyn]

Yep, I've played quite a bit of D6 system and D20. They are clunky in different ways.

D20 is clunky due to the rules bulge and the extreme (sometimes excrucating) detail that must be taken to prep a game. I've gotten to the point I'll play D20, but I won't run it again until I've had some time to detox.

D6 is clunky not due to complexity, but due to mathematical probabilities and how it runs in play. It gives even wonkier results than many dice pool systems I've played in, largely due to the wild die. A 1 in 6 chance of extreme success or 1 in 6 of failure is WAY too high of odds and variability in the system. As a player, I found it hard to have a decent grasp of my chances of success in the system, and as a result it detracted a lot of the fun from the game to me because of the extreme randomness. Also, D6 Star Wars characters felt like chumps a lot of the time, unless you were a Jedi. In that case the Jedi character did everything and the other players sat back and occasionally contributed a technical skill roll.

Not sure you did the Wild Die fully accurately. When a 1 was rolled on the Wild Die it would have one of 3 possible results (depending on importance of the moment and GM fiat). It could simply add 1 to your roll. It could take away the Wild Die and the highest # you rolled. Finally, something spectacular could happen. I always pointed to the movie to show dramatic failure examples. In the original movie Han Solo rolled a "1" on his Wild Die to bluff the storm troopers in the Death Star tunnel. He succeeded on the roll but got the "1". They turn and flee thinking they are outnumbered by rebel saboteurs but run down a blocked/dead end tunnel forcing them to turn and face our beloved, but lonely at the moment hero. Another would be in the RotJ when Han rolled a "1" to sneak up on the Scout Troopers. They get away. Great chase scene ensues, meet the Ewoks, the Empire's fate is sealed as the ewoks saved the rebels.

But I freely admit the Wild Die is not everyone's cup of tea. I just don't think that makes it "clunky". Just a disliked component. Sorry, its just that I loved the game and the characters of my players never felt like they were forced to live in the shadow of the movie heroes. As for Jedi, we did a great Tales of the Jedi campaign that everyone loved. And I would say the characters were well ahead of the curve compared to the Jedi of the newest trilogy. Again though, I freely accept that not everyone enjoys the same games.

 

[harmyn]

Errr...nope. I'm referring to the catalog I flipped through at my FLGS a few years back while looking for "something new".

OTOH, I might be thinking of Conan supplements. Maybe 2nd Edition. It was a while ago, but I remember thinking "There's like two and a half pages, two columns a page, in 8pt-font...just for GURPS? No, I don't think we'll be doing -that-".

On GURPS, there were many many many many many many books published for the game. But most of them were stand alone resource supplements. The only ongoing lines they have had for GURPS sourcebooks have been Traveller (very popular for them), Transhuman Space (again popular), and WWII (just because they wanted to I am thinking, but it was well done). They did do a collection of Conan books (three or four maybe) and a series of Horror styled books (most were stand alone but they could be combined together for added goodness). Only one Robin Hood book though. Think of it like buying D&D. If you enjoy Eberron or Planescape great, but you don't have to invest in the entire pulped rain forest line of Forgotten Realms product to enjoy them. If your not familiar with the company and their books though it could look very daunting.

And GURPS isn't for everyone by a long shot. Still as reference material they can't be beat.

 

[devilbat]

* Vampire, because I met people who played Vampire.

I thought the same thing, but didn't have the stones to post it. Good on you.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

There are lots of minor games that turned me off- I won't bother to list them here.

But the 3 MAJOR games that turned me off are M:TG, GURPS, and the White Wolf line.

First, M:TG...I love this game (HUH?)

I played it from the days of the Alpha release up until 6th Edition. I got turned off by the increasingly idiotic rules changes on how powers worked, banning cards that weren't broken (but were part of a broken combo), and most annoyingly, the continued introduction of cards that were immediately recognizable as broken.

I still play, but I don't buy cards anymore, and I don't compete in tourneys, either.

GURPS. Despite claiming to be a Generic Universal Role Playing System, I found it not to be Generic nor Universal. I played in an Austin game group that played a lot of different RPGs including a lot of GURPS because a couple of the guys in the group were regular SJG playtesters.

Every time we tried a new GURPS campaign, we had to deal with new, setting-specific rules variants- some were quite fundamental shifts. Some abilities were also ridiculously underpowered or overpowered. I remember trying to play a telekinetic PC. He was expensive AND ineffective under the basic GURPS rules. If I had been able to use GURPS Supers (or whatever it was) he would have been more in line with the power of the other PCs in the group...but that supplement wasn't available for the setting.

I understand that 4th Ed has improved greatly upon the previous editions of the game, but, at this point, I'm not touching it unless someone asks me to play.

White Wolf...I love the games themselves- good flavor with an acceptible system. Why do I hate the line? Because they don't integrate their products. We tried mixing Mages with Werewolves and Vampires...it just didn't work.

The new editions may be more compatible with each other, but I'm not spending my dollars to find out.