Gaming Meta Questions (long)

[Joshua Randall]

I stand by my assertion that this is just rehashing a tired old argument about the supposed weaknesses of D&D 3.5 . Y'know what? D&D 3.5 is the current edition of the game. You can play it, or you can dig up your old books and use those. But complaining about the current edition isn't changing anything.

 

[kenobi65]

My recommendation? He needs to find a local experience apart from the RPGA, because con gaming will lack the continuity and in-depth role-play that a home group can have. I stress that you can find in con games plenty of cameraderie, fun times, and good memories, but the games themselves will always be more disjointed that personal experience.

I think that's a very, very good recommendation. I play a *lot* of RPGA stuff, but most of it's with people that I already know. Random games with 5 strangers tend to be about the least satisfying for me.

 

[Ceresco]

Henry,


My recommendation? He needs to find a local experience apart from the RPGA, because con gaming will lack the continuity and in-depth role-play that a home group can have. I stress that you can find in con games plenty of cameraderie, fun times, and good memories, but the games themselves will always be more disjointed that personal experience.

I would also suggest he try out ENWorld, and check into a local ENWorld Gameday, if one is nearby to him. Chatting with the people from these forums is a blast, for all the reasons you mention; gaming with them is even moreso. I don't want to come off as elitist, by far, because Gencon is by far my favorite convention ever; but you were speaking of a "vetting" process, and the people who make it so fun to be here on a regular basis are what make it fun to game with them in person, too. In a sense, they're "vetted" from regular convention-going crowds just by virtue of liking this place enough to stick around, even with the tone of moderation we try to establish here.

(re-reading that, it still comes off as a bit snobbish, but I can't think of another way to put it: Having a community of people who get along well in one environment are more likely to get along in other environments, is a better way. And not just enworld: If there are a number of people local to you who frequent a favored to you online community, it's a good experiment to try.)[/QUOTE]

I agree with your asessment of the community here. Dave is in Southeast Michigan. Is there an EN World game day in that area?

 

[Ceresco]

Patryn of Elvenshae

Social skills are one of the strengths of d20.

They allow someone who is not a gifted orator, silver-tongued lawyer, or fast-talking con-man to roleplay a character who is.

But aren't we already having this discussion?

http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=154548

Thanks for the link. Good reading. It's made me take another look at the question of social skills. I've been of the opinion that role playing is a skill that can be learned if practiced enough. I know that's how it worked for me. Not so different than public speaking, which can be taught and learned by anyone willing to put the time and effort into it.

I recognize that using the game mechanics to play a role that one might not otherwise be able to fill with natural ability has become part of D&D. I like d20 and what D&D has evolved into. It is definately more accessible because of it. Perhaps I was spoiled during AD&D to play with gifted orators, silver-tounged laywers (to be), and fast talking con-men becuase that's exactly who I played with in the begining.

It seems to really be a question of gaming style. Isn't there an article online about the different styles of gaming? That might be a good link to send my friend Dave.

 

[werk]

My recommendation? He needs to find a local experience apart from the RPGA, because con gaming will lack the continuity and in-depth role-play that a home group can have.

I second this recommendation. I personally dislike the RPGA and Living anything (for no good reason), but love RPGs and D&D in specific. I play frequently and encourage others to learn and play

I think of it like beer. (universal Wisconsin analogy)

Some people like dark beer, some like light beer.
Some like to drink with the same small group of friends, some prefer to drink at huge festivals with lots of drinking strangers.

It doesn't matter how you like to drink beer, just make sure that you drink it the way that will make you most happy...and trial and error until you figure out what that is.

 

[Henry]

Perhaps I was spoiled during AD&D to play with gifted orators, silver-tounged laywers (to be), and fast talking con-men becuase that's exactly who I played with in the begining.

I grew up playing with the opposite - gamers who enjoyed the effective character, the fabulous riches, the fun stories that came out of doing outrageous activities. However, both experiences tend to limit our range of realizing what's possible - and one thing to note is that it is useful to have some kind of gauge on just how effective a speaker someone is, without the DM rejecting it out of hand based on personal preference.

Looking at it thusly, there WAS no in-game social component in RPGs, other than what the players and DMs decided to bring; the rules clearly defined physical prowess, but left mental and social prowess totally up to the gamers at hand. Being forced to consider social prowess now can be seen as a good thing -- or it can be played strictly as much of a numbers game as combat is, and leave people feeling "dumbed down" from previous.

EDIT - I amend part of my statement; there was some social prowess linked to charisma, but totally limited to first reactions via CHA, and what benefits of loyalty it gave towards henchmen. The number of groups I saw who used that in my area twenty years ago I could count on a closed fist.

 

[Henry]

I agree with your asessment of the community here. Dave is in Southeast Michigan. Is there an EN World game day in that area?

The CHICAGO Gameday at Games Plus in Mount Prospect, IL is by far the biggest one in that neck of the woods. It's loosely about 300 miles from your friend's location, though. Amusingly enough, it's happening this weekend, and a TON of ENWorlders go there for every time (it happens I believe about three times a year). I think there's another annual or semi-annual meetup in Columbus, OH, but again, that's a pretty stiff drive. If he starts checking out ENWorld, and likes what he finds here, I'd tell him to then start being on the lookout for EN Gamedays close to his area. Heck, he may want to start one himself. I know of a friend of mine in North Carolina who almost single-handedly started the NC Gamedays when he noticed that there were a lot of people on ENWorld in the NC area, and volunteered to get it rolling. Now it's a tri-organization sponsored event, held at a Raleigh college, and has a good 30 to 50 people three times a year meet up. The Boston one is held at various people's homes, and rotates among three or four people. The Virginia EN Gameday is at a convention center, I think. It's a varied experience, each one taking on the characteristics of the region it's hosted in.

 

[Odhanan]

This is an ongoing question in the rpg community. It is, in many peoples opinions (mine included), the most important issue in the hobby today. How do we attract new players, and bring back the Daves and Aarons, to the hobby?

There is a simple, short answer to this: run games for kids. If you have children, propose a game with your kid and friends on a Saturday afternoon. Run a campaign for them.

Don't have kids? You could propose activities for summer town attractions, associations, the local school, propose a game to a neighbor's kid and so on. The key then would be for parents, teachers, responsible adults in charge of the kids to trust you. They should trust you, and you have to to show they can trust you. There are many dangers for young kids, and playing with a pedophile is one of them (I know a gamer who was abused that way).

Bottom line: if you want kids to come to the hobby, you've got to make it known to them and open the doors of imagination to them. That's what I do with the local school (my fiancee is a teacher there), and did before with associations and summer activities.

 

[EricNoah]

I think as you get older, it can be challenging to establish new relationships of any type (gaming or not) -- older adults don't always have or use the same social options as younger adults. High school and college have numerous social opportunities built in -- as an older adult, you have to be a bit more assertive about joining groups (reading groups, athletic teams, churches, etc.) in order to make new friends. It's very difficult. And then finding someone to bring into the hobby is yet another order of magnitude harder.