Gate: Not Broken At All?

[kreynolds]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Gate: Not Broken At All?

I'm not saying they wouldn't, just that they would have to take steps. Most of the really powerful outsiders are automatically protected. So while Gating an Elemental might give you a chance at controlling them, Gating a Solar would not mean you have absolute control.

Well, I think I just had a revelation. I think it would be easier for you to just ban Monster Summon 8 & 9 and call it a day, as opposed to evolving, protecting, equiping the myriad of outsiders that are worth summoning. Basically, that's what you want to do, eliminate Monster Summoning 9, or at least prevent all monsters from Monster Summoning 9 from being gated. Right? Just some food for thought.

 

[Cloudgatherer]

The SM I-IX series of spell is very weak, IMO. Why would someone cast SM IX when they could cast gate?

As per the original question, "Gate: Not Broken At All?", this has come up before and my answer is going to be similar: you'd better know or be on *real* nice terms with who you gate in. If a cleric uses gate in a situation a Solar would deem "below him" or "a purely mortal affair" (i.e. there's no real evil demon to slay here), than said Solar might have to "explain" to the cleric about appropriate usage of his powers....

Preferably, a character would gate an outsider he knows or knows from somewhere else. Maybe even do a "preliminary gate" to appease a powerful being so they won't really mind coming to your aide.

Admittedly, these are RP balances for the spell that are up to the DM.

 

[Shard O'Glase]

I think as kreynolds points out if you follow this form of logic then you can't use summon moster 8-9 because those lsits are made up of those powerful creatures that would naturally have the right defenses up. Me I'd assume they are on the list because they actually can be summoned and controlled, and your constant proteciton v evil idea doesn't hold much water. Which returns us to Gate is way broken, unless you either change it(my route) or use roleplaying considerations to limit it, ie solar gives you a stern talking to as per cloudgatherer's sugestion.

 

[Elaer]

Good points. I was just throwing it out there to see if this fit the rules. I agree it would ruin the upper level Summon Monster Spells, but it would prevent the possibility of Gating in Pit Fiends, telling them to stand still and lower their spell resistance (because, by the letter of the spell, they have to do whatever you tell them, as long as it takes less than one round per caster level).

 

[kreynolds]

I agree it would ruin the upper level Summon Monster Spells, but it would prevent the possibility of Gating in Pit Fiends, telling them to stand still and lower their spell resistance (because, by the letter of the spell, they have to do whatever you tell them, as long as it takes less than one round per caster level).

Sounds like one of your players was trying to create an XP machine.

 

[Victim]

Yes, but IIRC, summoned craetures are part of the ability of the caster, and thus count under his CR, not their own. So summoning monsters for XP doesn't work.

 

[Rowenstin]

IIRC Gate calls creatures, dont summon them. It´s an important difference, since a dead called creature is truly dead.