D&D 5E (2014) Getting the AD&D feel in 5th edition

[Rune]

Exactly.

 

[Nebulous]

so you essentially have a -1 to -9 initiative penalty (except for cantrips and bonus or quickened spells). Yeah, I guess that would work. The trick then would convincing players to go along with it and not argue because the DM thinks it's kewl

 

[Rune]

so you essentially have a -1 to -9 initiative penalty (except for cantrips and bonus or quickened spells). Yeah, I guess that would work. The trick then would convincing players to go along with it and not argue because the DM thinks it's kewl

Also, if you really want to capture that "sometimes spells are cast on the next round" feel, use a d10 for initiative!

 

[steeldragons]

Weapon speeds make perfect sense in a real world simulation. If you're in cramped quarters, you pull out two daggers and knife the bad guy with the slow, bulky broadsword before he can recover from his swing. In D&D, that degree of realism doesn't fit in.

Not saying they don't make sense. I think it certainly can fit in, if that's what everyone wants to do. Fit in the 1e's UA.

Just not sure if it's something I or my table would be interested in having to bother figuring in all of the time. My bit[1e]d group rarely bothered, though I do recall a particular player being all about it and making sure he got his attacks in before anyone else...we certainly didn't care and he had fun with it, so win-win. Other times we had a "full/everything RAW" climactic/uber battle where it got used...rarely, but it happened.

 

[Nebulous]

I think, ultimately, weapon speed is more of a conceptually neat-o idea than necessarily one i would actually use.

 

[sithramir]

5e combats are designed to be 2-3 rounds on average. Seems like multi round spells might make casters nearly useless and a lot of average combats . Probably works for the first 8 to 10 levels but it seems almost foolish at higher level play

 

[fuindordm]

I like Nebulous' idea--spell level penalty to initiative count. So you initiative is 13, you want to cast a 5th level spell, that means you're continuously casting from count 13 to count 9 and the spell goes off on count 8. This means that the enemies have a short window to attack you and force a concentration check to avoid disrupting the spell. I don't think I would make them lose the spell slot; losing your action for the round is bad enough.

I would allow a few spells to have lower than normal casting times, notably the power words.

 

[KarinsDad]

Not sure what I can do about Weapons Speed (not sure if I'd want to), but for the spells, my homebrew/houserule is a blanket +1 round of casting per spell level over 3. So a 4th level spell takes 2 rounds (in 5e terms, 2 actions), 3 rounds @ 5th, and so on.

It REALLY helps maintain that "gotta keep the foes off the mage/the mage safe" even when at levels where the mage could take care of themselves.

That's another thing for the 1e feel: Spell disruption. It happens. It screws you up. You lose the spell, no effect (or if you're feeling VERY 1e, give 'em a roll on yon Sorcerer's Wild Magic table, for a particularly 'bad" disruption).

I can not stress enough the XP for gold and keeping/incorporating training at level up. That, to me is the biggest mechanic crutch of a 1e style experience. Perhaps only matched by/along with...

Differing XP tables. Everybody levels at a different rate. "Simple" classes: Fighters, Thieves, et al. level the fastest. "Rarer/more complex" classes: I'd put your Barbarians, your clerics, your rangers here, level slower. The most unusual/rare/specialized powers classes: your Mages, Paladins, [Psions if you use them], et al. level the slowest to keep their "more powerful than everybody else" in check.

You do realize that in 5E (with a few rare exceptions like the Moon Circle Druid), the "simple classes" are in reality the "more powerful than everybody else" classes until at least level 5 (Fireball) and really pretty much strong movers and shakers in a party until at least level 13 or so? In 5E, low to mid level spell casters tend to be versatile, not powerful. Yes, there are a few times a day exceptions (like maybe Sleep at low level), but the simple classes shine a lot. Really no need to gimp the casters. Do you remove the extra two attacks per round of high level fighters because none of the other martial types can attack that often? Do you drop the Paladin's AC because even with Mage Armor and multiple Shield spells, the Wizard can only get up to AC 20 a few times per day?

It's a game. Gimping leveling rates and casting times means that you favor one style of player over another. I get the XP for gold and training ideas, but the rest of these seem excessively punitive for no good reason. Players who are "me, me, me" might worry about spell casters and other less simple classes having more power and versatility at higher levels, but players who are pro-team instead of pro-self ignore that crap.

 

[fuindordm]

Personally, I don't think the different XP tables and levelling rates are an essential part of the AD&D experience. I'm more interested in exploring those AD&D rules that have an effect on the players' choices and tactics during the game.

And furthermore, this is all just a thought experiment.

I also realize that the proposed changes to rules for wizards weaken the class--eventually if I adopted these changes I would look for ways to compensate the players.

I'm also not proposing limiting wizards to 1 spell slot per level at first level, zero cantrips, or any other such horrors!

 

[Anth]

I also want a 5E game with a 1E feel, but for the moment I'm waiting for the DMG and the conversion guide before I set up any definitive house rules.

So far this is what I got:

Generating ability scores
3d6 in order.
You may reroll (if you want) the whole row if:
- no ability is above 13.
- two abilities are below 8.
- the sum of the ability modifiers are below +1.

You can swap two (and only two) abilities with each other.

You can raise one ability 1 step if you lower another ability 1 step. You can repeat this two times, but no ability can be raised or lowered more than 1 step and no ability can be outside the 3-18 range.

The above method should generate similar values as roll 4d6 drop lowest, but I think it has a more old school feel to it.


No max hp at level 1
Instead roll for hp twice and drop lowest. If the roll is still under ½ max hp, you get ½ max hp instead.

When you gain a level you reroll all your hp. You still roll twice, drop lowest for level 1.
So when a fighter become 2nd level he roll 3d10 and drop the lowest.
Would he instead choose to multiclass to a wizard he would roll 2d10 and drop lowest + 1d6.
If the new hp is equal or lower than the old hp you still gain 1 hp.


Xp for gold

Grant XP for treasure at a 1xp=1gp rate. Introduce training costs as a way of soaking up the treasure. Grant XP for monsters at 10%, so combat still contributes.

Exactly what I would do.


Natural healing
First: I wouldn't change the magical healing, remember that in 5E all monsters have about twice as much hp as in 1E. The characters need the magical healing as it is.

Secondly: I would use/tweak the tools I have in 5E: short rest, long rest, and tiers (level 1-4, 5-10, 11-16, 17-20).

Short rest:
The number of HD you have is equal to your tier:
1 HD at level 1-4
2 HD at level 5-10
3 HD at level 11-16
4 HD at level 17-20.

Long rest
You spend a number of HD equal to your tier (see short rest above).
The HD not used during a long rest is used to replentish your short rest HD pool.

Resting in bed a whole day between two long rests is treated as one more long rest.

I wouldn't use rules for wounds/vitality, because it didn't exist in 1E.

I wouldn't have special rules for different damage types.
But I will probably have some special rule for life drain when your maximum hp is lowered, as this equals the old energy level drain.
Probably a CON save after a long rest to get rid of the effect, DC 8 + monsters proficiency bonus + monsters CHA modifier.


Death
Every time a character is reduced to zero hp and start making death saves he gains a level of exhaustion.

Instant death
When you drop to zero hp you must make a instant death saving throw (no ability modifier) or die, DC is the remaining damage divided by your proficiency bonus.

Instead of losing a death save if you take damage when already at 0 hp you have to make a new instant death save or die.

For more fun: do not roll any death saves / instant death saves until someone spending an action on the unconscious character.
The character is like Schrödingers cat: no one, not even the characters player, knows if the character is dead or alive until someone looking after him.


Learn spells
To learn new spells (including the spells automatically gained at level 1 and higher levels) a wizard must make an INT check vs. DC 15. Yes it is a high DC, but I would allow rerolls of failed checks when the caster gain a new level.