GMing the Ready Action

[Water Bob]

The 3.5 DMG strongly suggests that combat actions only take place inside of a combat round (with the exception of healing spells, and the like, that make sense occurring outside of combat).

The Ready Action specifically states that when the action is used, the character using it cannot move other than using a five foot step--and if that five foot step is used, then Movement cannot be the action readied.

But, it seems to me if we GM's allow outside of combat, while a character is moving, that a lot of logical and realism problems will be solved.

Take, for example, the Ranger with bow and an arrow nocked, the archer himself alert, ready, and "on point", leading the party down dusty, dark dungeon corridors. The Ranger turns a corner and sees a hobgoblin guard 60 feet away from. The Hobgloblin sees the Ranger as he comes around the corner.

Initiative is thrown. The Hobby wins and charges the Ranger, attacking him at a lowered defense, catching him flatfooted.

The Ranger is alert and on point with arrow nocked--yet, he's considered flat-footed? And the Hobgloblin can charge 60 feet and attack before the Ranger can get off his nocked arrow?

Does that seem right to you?

If we make a combat maneuver that is akin to the Ready Action, but allows him to walk and act outside of combat, then, what we get is this, in the above scenario: Ranger fires bow --> Hobby charges and chatches Ranger flat-footed.

I'm still not sure about the whole "flat-footed" part, given the Ranger's condition, but I left it in just to keep the rules as true to RAW as possible.





Now, I've read a few posts, here and there, where people has said that playing the Ready Actio loosely like that, outside of combat, opens a whole can of worms.

What worms will be opened? I'm not sure I see the implications of playing the game as I said above.

Comments from experienced 3.5 GMs?

 

[Lwaxy]

corner.


If we make a combat maneuver that is akin to the Ready Action, but allows him to walk and act outside of combat, then, what we get is this, in the above scenario: Ranger fires bow --> Hobby charges and chatches Ranger flat-footed.

We often do that for readied actions, in the above descriptions the ranger would have fired before the battle. Another GM I play with adds an automatic 10 to the initiative if someone has an action readied. More logical that way.

 

[Sekhmet]

When I was in the military, this sort of scenario happened extremely often. A group of soldiers move through a compound at the ready, and can typically react to any assault from their forward field of view within a second.
These soldiers are highly trained (like the Ranger), but even then (as I've seen) they can be surprised during this action.

If all round actions occur over the course of 6 seconds, and a Hobgoblin can Charge 60ft in one round, then we can assume that a Hobgoblin Charges 10 feet per second (which is about right).

If the Ranger turns the corner and the Hobgoblin is within 10ft of that corner, and notices him immediately, then I'd allow initiative to be rolled and (in your scenario) the Hobgoblin to strike the flat-footed Ranger. This is exactly how it happens in real world, urban combat.

Anything beyond about 10ft, I wouldn't even bother giving the Hobgoblin a chance to roll initiative. I'd just give the Ranger a surprise round and call it good.


The "can of worms" that is opened is when Wizard Readies Action CombatEndingSpell around every corner.

 

[Greenfield]

One extremely popular accessory in the Equipment section is the small mirror. In older editions it was made clear that at least part of its purpose was that it let you look around corners without stepping into sight.

While the mirror itself can be spotted, it's Fine in size, and so Spot checks are made at a penalty.

A good scout type will make liberal use of this, as part of his routine Stealth maneuvering, and thus avoid the scene you just described.

Another option would be for the Ranger to approach the corner at normal movement, then declare his Ready, and use only a 5 foot step to clear the corner. Now he gets his shot off before the Hobgoblin charges. In effect, he's dropping into "combat" time at that point, restricting his movement and preparing for battle.

Allowing Ready outside of combat as a regular thing will result in players who are *always* on "ready action", every waking minute of every day. I've seen it and I'm pretty sure everyone else here has seen it as well. And we've all had to cast Dispel BS on it more than once.

Inviting it into the game is a bad idea. Good scouting techniques and tactics can solve your problem without any significant changes to the rules.

 

[RUMBLETiGER]

We often do that for readied actions, in the above descriptions the ranger would have fired before the battle. Another GM I play with adds an automatic 10 to the initiative if someone has an action readied. More logical that way.

I'd second this. The knocked arrow, aiming, expecting danger, turn around the corner would grant the ranger a surprise round of attack, and then initiative would be rolled.
Surprise round.

 

[kitcik]

I'd second this. The knocked arrow, aiming, expecting danger, turn around the corner would grant the ranger a surprise round of attack, and then initiative would be rolled.
Surprise round.

We also treat it as a surprise round, in which only characters with readied actions may act.

 

[Michael Silverbane]

Take, for example, the Ranger with bow and an arrow nocked, the archer himself alert, ready, and "on point", leading the party down dusty, dark dungeon corridors. The Ranger turns a corner and sees a hobgoblin guard 60 feet away from. The Hobgloblin sees the Ranger as he comes around the corner.

Initiative is thrown. The Hobby wins and charges the Ranger, attacking him at a lowered defense, catching him flatfooted.

The Ranger is alert and on point with arrow nocked--yet, he's considered flat-footed? And the Hobgloblin can charge 60 feet and attack before the Ranger can get off his nocked arrow?

Does that seem right to you?

This does not seem at all out of whack to me. The ranger in question was attempting to be alert and prepared. He thought he was being alert and prepared, but when the time came to act, he choked.

[edit] To get a bit more into the question that you are asking, rather than just sniping at your premise. I've seen a DM who allowed readying actions outside of combat. What usually came out of it was the guy who kicked in the door getting peppered with arrows or stabbed in the liver by the monsters waiting on the other side.

One thing that I've seen work with some success it to treat the first round of all combats as a surprise round, with only a Move or Standard action taking place, but not both, for all opponents. I don't think this would necessarily solve your problem, though, since being charged from 30 feet away while 'ready with an arrow' is very nearly the same as being charged from 60 feet away.

 

[Man in the Funny Hat]

The dm determines surprise. It either exists or it doesn't. Either the rangers declaration that he is quiet, cautious and prepared is good enough to grant him surprise when he walks around that corner or it isn't. If surprise does exist then the dm has no business calling for an initiative check yet. If it doesn't exist then question itself illustrates the difficulties inherent in allowing a character to Ready outside of combat. How do you grant surprise advantages even as initiative says he doesn't HAVE a surprise advantage? You've put the cart before the horse.

Surprise is supposed to be merely awareness of the presence of opposition. The OP description suggests that the hobgoblin and ranger ARE aware of each other at the same time. Then it becomes necessary for the dm to either GRANT initiative to the ranger or give him a bonus to his roll and accept that the normal, random consequences of combat then still apply.

 

[Water Bob]

One extremely popular accessory in the Equipment section is the small mirror. In older editions it was made clear that at least part of its purpose was that it let you look around corners without stepping into sight.

[MENTION=6669384]Greenfield[/MENTION] - you consistently have thoughtful ideas when you post. I want to thank you for that. I'd XP you, but, again, the system won't let me because I guess I've given you too much XP in the past.

Another option would be for the Ranger to approach the corner at normal movement, then declare his Ready, and use only a 5 foot step to clear the corner.

Technically, this would be an illegal RAW move because combat actions should normally be used only within a combat round (per the 3.5 DMG, pg. 23). But, I do like the idea--makes a good tweak, and a good way to handle the situation.

Allowing Ready outside of combat as a regular thing will result in players who are *always* on "ready action", every waking minute of every day. I've seen it and I'm pretty sure everyone else here has seen it as well. And we've all had to cast Dispel BS on it more than once.

Yeah, I've already seen that in discussions with my players. One is even saying, "Why should have have to declare a Ready Action? I've got my spear at the ready. I'm alert. I'm ready to let loose all sorts of havoc. I should always be using the Ready Acton."

This, right here, convinces me not to go with the idea cited in the OP.

 

[Spatula]

Now, I've read a few posts, here and there, where people has said that playing the Ready Actio loosely like that, outside of combat, opens a whole can of worms.

What worms will be opened? I'm not sure I see the implications of playing the game as I said above.

If you allow Ready actions outside of combat, then everyone (PCs and NPCs) has Ready actions at all times when conscious (I mean, why not? it doesn't cost you anything when you're outside of combat rounds), and then there's really no point. You come down to rolling initiative to see whose Ready action goes off first, which is essentially just saying that everyone gets to act in the surprise round, regardless of surprise.

Which is unnecessary, because the surprise round already covers the situation in an elegant fashion. If you get the jump on someone, you get a single action - your "readied action" that you were preparing as you laid in wait. For the ambush-ee, if you spotted the ambush you get a "readied action" of your own - you get a single action in the surprise round. Otherwise, you were unprepared for the attack and have to wait until the 1st full round of combat to act.

What might make more sense is to remove the "flat-footed until you act" rule, which can be hard to justify if neither party is surprised. Obviously, I would keep the rule for the surprise round, if there is one.