Gnoll time!

[rossik]

my party is about to fight a dragonne (or something like that), but ima afraid its too easy for them.

one night before, they fought a band of gnolls, so i thought that the ones who escape could call some friends and attack the party just after they fought the dragonne.

dragonne's lair is a cave at the top of a hill (a hill is a "short montain", right?), so the gnolls will fire flaming arrows at the party before they get out.

two questions then:

would you think that the DM is just trying to make pcs weaker, attacking them just after a fight, thus thinking that is unfair, or it seems reasonable to you?

what about gnolls fighting techinique? they are not dumb, just a little coward (no?)

(oh, all this for 2ed , pls)

 

[Tonguez]

Why can't the gnolls fight with the Dragonne?

Its inteligent and neutral so perehaps the Gnolls could convince it to assist (or if the gnolls know the PCs are after the Dragonne they could offer to help it)

Gnolls are crafty guerilla-fighting predators IMC, not stupid and not cowardly, but they do prefer stealth and rapid 'skirmishing' to direct 'head-to-head' combat

 

[rossik]

oh, but dragonne have animal inteligence, so i dont thing they can talk.

also, i dont whant the gnolls to fight the dragoone, but fight the players. the question is do you, as a player, think its fair fight, or im pushing them around a little?

they are 5 level, but dont know why, they have 3 level power

 

[Rackhir]

oh, but dragonne have animal inteligence, so i dont thing they can talk.

also, i dont whant the gnolls to fight the dragoone, but fight the players. the question is do you, as a player, think its fair fight, or im pushing them around a little?

they are 5 level, but dont know why, they have 3 level power

If you mean this monster

Dragonne

I've never played 2e, so I can only go off of what I know from 3.5 and in 3.5 it's a cr7, meaning that unless you have a very large party (much bigger than 4 char) that just the dragonne is going to be a very tough fight. If they are a weak party (You seem to be saying they are the equivalent of only 3rd level characters), then you are likely to wipe out the entire party with just the dragonne.

Also in 3.5 a Dragonne has a 6 int. While they aren't very bright, they should be able to speak common and make at least basic plans.

 

[tankschmidt]

I've never played 2e...

Hah-hah! I'll similarly offer advice for the wrong edition, although there's probably not much difference between 1st and 2nd edition AD&D. In 1st edition, dragonnes speak Brass Dragon and Sphinx, and gnolls speak gnoll, chaotic evil, troll, hobgoblin, and orc, so the two probably won't be able to communicate. Still, if the gnolls know the dragonne is there, they might ambush the PCs while the party is fighting the beast. They might even know that the Dragonne's roar has a range of 12" (in 1st edition anyway), so they could stay far away enough that it won't affect them.

I certainly wouldn't think poorly of a DM who did this at all. In fact if the combat goes poorly, it's the PCs fault for letting a bunch of gnolls escape and then sticking around for the inevitable counterattack, especially if the gnoll king or leader-type wasn't killed. And it's well within a gnoll's ability to come up with this sort of simple plan.

 

[rossik]

Hah-hah! I'll similarly offer advice for the wrong edition, although there's probably not much difference between 1st and 2nd edition AD&D. In 1st edition, dragonnes speak Brass Dragon and Sphinx, and gnolls speak gnoll, chaotic evil, troll, hobgoblin, and orc, so the two probably won't be able to communicate. Still, if the gnolls know the dragonne is there, they might ambush the PCs while the party is fighting the beast. They might even know that the Dragonne's roar has a range of 12" (in 1st edition anyway), so they could stay far away enough that it won't affect them.

I certainly wouldn't think poorly of a DM who did this at all. In fact if the combat goes poorly, it's the PCs fault for letting a bunch of gnolls escape and then sticking around for the inevitable counterattack, especially if the gnoll king or leader-type wasn't killed. And it's well within a gnoll's ability to come up with this sort of simple plan.

thanks for the advice!

rackhir, heres 2ed dragonne:
http://mmadnd.chat.ru/MM00082.htm

yeah, maybe they will get a hard time...but hey, they went to that cave cause they wann to, i dont forced them. i even describe it as having half eating horses and human skeletons

 

[DrunkonDuty]

I agree with Tankschmidt's assessment. Heck, as a player I'd really enjoy the challenge. And I think that the escaped Gnolls make it perfectly reasonable. Go for it. Just be careful in case the Dragonne turns out a tougher fight than expected. Maybe let the PCs spot the ambush and be able to retreat back into the cave. Could always trap them in there a few days with the dead and rotting carcass of the Dragonne. Force them to try and negotiate with the Gnolls. Maybe even extend the cave into a system of caves to explore.

I think the idea has great potential to carry on into a mini- series of adventures.

And no: I don't think there's anything wrong with hitting the PCs with a couple of tough fights in close succession. This whole "4 encounters a day" thing that 3E includes in its rules is just lame lame lame.

 

[Tonguez]

oh, but dragonne have animal inteligence, so i dont thing they can talk.

dragonne have low intelligence, can speak the language of brass dragons and shinxes and are not overty aggressive. ergo a clever gnoll could convince it that they are helping it against invaders (the PCs) allowing them to work together

I'd enjoy this fight

 

[rossik]

so, today we fight the dragone...

the thing is, its was not as tough as i thought. it managed to drop the mage to -4 hp, and take 16 from teh fighter.

it deals lot of damage (1d8/1d8/3d6), but it had 9 hd, so it was not that hard. so i decide that before they search for treasure, the gnolls started shooting flaming arrows at the "door" (its not a door, i just cant describe it ) of the cavern.

so the players were traped inside.
ok, so they didnt move or anything, they just wait.

to spice things, (and that may be a problem), i added a hill giant. the gnolls "pay" him with goods to help him. he started to throw rocks (and killed a npc, and knocked the mage AGAIN-after the cleric had healed up), then opened space to the gnolls to attack (the giant was too big for the cavern).


so, to stay in topic, i just whant to thank all the ideas. i made the gnolls something like fierce barbarians, and not coward hyenas from "the lion king".

 

[tankschmidt]

Glad to have helped. Sounds like a great adventure. Are the PCs still trapped within the cavern? I hope they brought rations!