Gnome Illusionist level 1

[doosler]

Thanks again to everyone who has been helping me pick a race and class for my character. I have one final dilemna to sort out. Any suggestions would be helpful.

Which character is better?

Gnome 1
str: 13
dex: 12
con: 12
int: 17
wis: 15
char: 13

Gnome 2
str: 8
dex: 12
con: 19
int: 15
wis: 15
char: 13

Setting Str aside, the main difference between these characters is: 12 Con, 17 Int vs. 19 Con, 15 Int. Which is better?

3 extra HP/level are nice. Plus a 19 Con is significantly more helpful on Concentration checks than a 12 Con, and I would have a better Fortitude save.

But +1 DC on every spell I cast is also nice (+2 DC on all spells for 15 Int vs. +3 DC on all spells for 17 Int).

What really makes me lean toward the higher Int is the extra bonus spell. A 15 Int gives one bonus spell for 1st level and one for 2nd level. A 17 Int gives an additional bonus spell for 3rd level. Since higher level spell slots can be used to cast lower level spells, and at 1st level I won't have any 2nd or 3rd level spells to cast, my DM is going to allow me to use the bonus 2nd and 3rd level spell slots to cast two extra 0th - 1st level spells each day. So, by taking a 17 Int instead of a 15 Int, I would get one extra 3rd level spell slot per day, to be filled by a 0th - 1st level spell at levels 1-2, a 0th - 2nd level spell at levels 3-4, and a 0th -3rd level spell at levels 5 and up. Considering the fact that a specialist wizard will give up two entire schools of magic for an extra spell slot per level per day from just one school of magic, it is tempting to give up 3 bonus HP/level for an extra spell per day that can be used to cast a spell from any school. (By the way, is my DM's rule -- that I can use my bonus 2nd and 3rd level spell slots to cast two extra 0th - 1st level spells per day at 1st level -- legal? I mean, according to the official rules?)

Plus, with a 17 Int I would start out with 4 extra skill points. I am planning on putting 4 points in Concentration, 4 points in Knowledge (Arcana), 4 points in Spellcraft, and 4 points in Craft (Alchemy). With a 17 Int, I would be able to put 1 point in two out of the following: Heal, Listen, Search, Spot, Move Silently, Hide, Climb, etc.

Which option should I go with? I have to decide by tomorrow night.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Something I don't understand on the builds: why the 15 in Wis when you could put that in Dex?

Besides that, I'd lean towards the first build.

 

[doosler]

My DM has a particular method for rolling scores. You roll your ability scores, and then you are allowed to switch two scores. After that, you make any racial modifications. I originally rolled:

str: 17
dex: 12
con: 10
int: 15
wis: 15
char: 13

If I were to switch Wis and Dex, my scores would be:

17
15
10
15
12
13

If I made that character a Gnome, my scores would be:

15
15
12
15
12
13

I considered both of those options, but decided against them. The two options at the beginning of this thread are my favorite candidates after considering probably about 25 different options over the past week.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Ok, just as long as it makes sense!

 

[Arkhandus]

You want the higher Intelligence. You need more spells per day at low levels and you need higher save DCs. Color Spray should be your staple 1st-level spell, and you want to ensure that it knocks out as many creatures as possible every time, so that they aren't trying to kill your frail, wizardly self.

Also, I'd suggest carrying around a greataxe, to coup de grace any opponents you render unconscious through Color Spray. Since they'll be unconscious and coup de grace is an automatic critical hit, you'll not have to worry about the nonproficiency penalty on attack rolls. My gnome sorcerer in a recent game had trouble dealing with enemies after they were Color Sprayed, with his low strength and carrying nothing more than a dagger and a crossbow for weaponry.

 

[IamTheTest]

The general rule that I use is: If most of your spells allow for saving throws, higher INT is great...If you rarely use such spells, CON is more important. All in all, its just preference.


@Ark...maybe a Scythe. Gnome+Scythe=Scary...especially with the proper illusions.

 

[Klaus]

I'd go with the higher Con, and you can then focus on increasing your Int as you go.

If you choose the executioner tactic arkhandus mentioned, carry a heavy pick. x4 crit is nothing to sneeze at.

 

[Felix]

Higher Con. So you can survive.

You want the higher Intelligence. You need more spells per day at low levels ...

This will only matter when you get to level 5. From level 1 to 4 there will be no difference in the number of spell per day between Int 15 and Int 17. And at level 4 you can put the ability point into Int, so there still won't be a difference until level 7. So for 6 levels, when the character is its most fragile, you won't gain a benefit for spells per day from having a higher Int.

...and you need higher save DCs.

Depends on the spells you use and how you use them. Illusions more than any other spell school can be worked so that you deny enemies the chance to even make a save.

 

[eamon]

Depends on the spells you use and how you use them. Illusions more than any other spell school can be worked so that you deny enemies the chance to even make a save.

There are a lot of illusion spells which require a saving throw. Unlike direct damage spells, if your opponent succeeds at his saving thow, he'll be completely unaffected.

You really want to max out Int at almost all costs. I'd choose the 17 Int, unless I expected to be hit frequently. Many wizards are never hit at all - esp. illusionists with many mirror images, or who are invisible or whatnot.

Incidentally, did you consider a beguiler?

 

[doosler]

From level 1 to 4 there will be no difference in the number of spell per day between Int 15 and Int 17. And at level 4 you can put the ability point into Int, so there still won't be a difference until level 7. So for 6 levels, when the character is its most fragile, you won't gain a benefit for spells per day from having a higher Int.

Felix, my DM is going to allow me to use my bonus spell slots to cast extra level 0 and level 1 spells at 1st level (15 Int = 1 bonus level 2 per day, 17 Int = 1 bonus level 2 and 1 bonus level 3 per day). At first level I won't be able to cast any level 2 spells. But since a 15 Int allows the capacity to "hold" a bonus 2nd level spell, and since higher level spell slots can be used to cast lower level spells, I can use that 2nd level spell slot at 1st level to cast a level 0 or level 1 spell. Once I reach 3rd level and can cast 2nd level spells, that bonus level 2 spell slot can be used to cast an extra level 2 spell per day (or, if I choose, an extra level 1 or 0 spell). So, with a 17 Int I would get a bonus level 3 spell slot, which could be used to cast an additional level 0 or level 1 spell per day at 1st level. At 3rd - 4th level, when I am able to cast 2nd level spells, I will be able to use that bonus 3rd level spell slot to cast an extra 0-2 level spell per day.

I think this rule can be derived from the following language:

Spell Slots
The various character class tables show how many spells of each level a character can cast per day. These openings for daily spells are called spell slots. A spellcaster always has the option to fill a higher-level spell slot with a lower-level spell. A spellcaster who lacks a high enough ability score to cast spells that would otherwise be his or her due still gets the slots but must fill them with spells of lower level.

(I found this at http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/arcaneSpells.htm)

A wizard with a 17 Int will only be able to prepare 7th level spells and below (because "to prepare a spell the wizard must have an Intelligence score of at least 10 + the spell’s level"). At 15th level, when that wizard gets his first level 8 spell slot, he won't be able to fill it with any level 8 spells, because he won't be intelligent enough to cast level 8 spells. The above quoted rule, however, allows him to utilize his level 8 spell slot to cast a lower level spell each day.

Similarly, if a wizard is so intelligent that he gets a bonus slot for a spell of a certain level, but hasn't gained enough experience to have learned any spells of that level yet, shouldn't he be able to use that slot to cast a lower level spell?

Is this against the rules? What do you guys think?