"God Bless America"
- Thread starter Dannyalcatraz
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El Mahdi
Muad'Dib of the Anauroch
Personally, I think the trends away from these types of displays in the common culture (at least in America) are two-fold.
One: Times have changed. People are less concerned with tradition and ceremony. It's viewed as an anachronistic holdover of an older age. It's not that people are less patriotic today, they just feel less of a need to show it or prove it through codified actions. Personally, I feel that a little bit of something has been lost, but times and mores change. That's just the way it is.
Two: I think the other may be that, since WWII, there's been a trend away from displays or hints of Nationalism in many parts of the world (especially Europe, America, and Japan). IMO, the world got a very harsh, first hand view, of the dark side of Nationalism. A view of what can happen when Nationalism is taken to extremes. Now, I'm not saying that Nationalism is inherently bad or good. Nationalism is a thing, just like anything else, that in moderation is just fine. But, perhaps in the aforementioned areas, there's something in our collective psyches that left us a little gun-shy to displays of Nationalism. Anyways, I don't want this to devolve into a politics discussion (which we all know is verboten here
), or devolve into a psychiatric discussion (which isn't verboten but IMO, is even a worse subject
) so I'll just leave it here without any extra analysis. It just is what it is, and my two cents.
One: Times have changed. People are less concerned with tradition and ceremony. It's viewed as an anachronistic holdover of an older age. It's not that people are less patriotic today, they just feel less of a need to show it or prove it through codified actions. Personally, I feel that a little bit of something has been lost, but times and mores change. That's just the way it is.
Two: I think the other may be that, since WWII, there's been a trend away from displays or hints of Nationalism in many parts of the world (especially Europe, America, and Japan). IMO, the world got a very harsh, first hand view, of the dark side of Nationalism. A view of what can happen when Nationalism is taken to extremes. Now, I'm not saying that Nationalism is inherently bad or good. Nationalism is a thing, just like anything else, that in moderation is just fine. But, perhaps in the aforementioned areas, there's something in our collective psyches that left us a little gun-shy to displays of Nationalism. Anyways, I don't want this to devolve into a politics discussion (which we all know is verboten here
), or devolve into a psychiatric discussion (which isn't verboten but IMO, is even a worse subject) so I'll just leave it here without any extra analysis. It just is what it is, and my two cents.
While there is some truth to what you say in general, its not a lack of nationalistic display I'm talking about in my OP.
Its a lack of a display when one is traditional- the playing of the national anthem- and adding the omitted one to a mere pop tune (albeit a patriotic one). IOW, its pure confusion.
Its a lack of a display when one is traditional- the playing of the national anthem- and adding the omitted one to a mere pop tune (albeit a patriotic one). IOW, its pure confusion.
Orius
Unrepentant DM Supremacist
You think you're irritated? My father's a Vietnam vet and gets really cheesed off about these sorts of things. But I think kids really aren't taught many of these things in school today, and a lot of these patriotic displays haven't been in fashion like they were back in the 50's since at least then end of the Cold War and probably a some time earlier (around the 70's or so).
There are other thoughts I have on the matter, but they'd probably violate the no-politics rule so I will remain silent.
frankthedm
First Post
Ditto my Dad.
I confess, I had a lot of it in my youth- I'll make 42 in October- after all, I was an Army brat who attended schools on base until I was 12 or so. (AND I was in Scouting). I couldn't say how much indoctrination other kids got up to that point...but when I went to civilian schools in Kansas and Colorado, we said the Pledge daily.
About Scouting. I know that we got a goodly dose of info on proper displays of the flag, how do display/dispose of them, when and how to salute, etc., and I recall meeting my Canadian counterparts at the Cub Scout Olympics in Munich who pretty much got the same kind of indoctrination for their country's symbols...
And I know there are still a fair number of Scouts (active and former) out there.
nerfherder
Adventurer
Well, in England we had to say the Cub Scout motto every week: "I promise to do my duty, to God and to the Queen, to help other people, and to keep the Cub Scout law".
Saluting, caps on and off, and all of that I only got when in the Air Training Corps.
Most English know the national anthem well enough to sing the first verse, especially at football matches, and doubly especially when playing Germany
but that's about it.[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUH0_H21FvM]YouTube - National anthem of England/UK - FIFA 06[/ame]
Oh, and it's impressive when performed by a Formula One car...
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGEqlNU30Tg[/ame]
megamania
Hero
Norman Rockwell.... more American than the Flag to many people.
I grew up next to him in his Vermont home. That said, I never met him but did have an art instruction or two from his assistant- mr. Pellum.
El Mahdi
Muad'Dib of the Anauroch
Ahhhhh, I see. I kind of took off on a whole other tangent, didnt' I? Oops! Sorry.
Yeah, I have seen that happen. It is kind of wierd and makes absolutely no sense to me either. But that's what some people do. I can't imagine that it was so long ago kids were brought up that way in school, that people would have forgotten what they are supposed to do (I'm only 41 and I remember being taught that in school, at least up into middle school). But it happens anyways. You're right. Absolutely baffling and frustrating.
I'm also surprised at how many people don't know how to properly handle or display the flag. When I first put a flag up at my house my wife just looked at me like I'd grown a third head when I told her how it was supposed to be handled (can't touch the ground, if it's out at night it needs to be illuminated, etc. - or how to properly fold it, although that can be a bit tricky). It bugs the hell out of me to see how many people leave them out at night with no illumination on the flag, or leave them flying when they are ratty and torn (even schools and government buildings!). I keep telling my wife that someday we're going to have a house where I can put up one of those 150' to 200' flag poles, with lighting, and fly a garrison flag 24/7. Just to show everyone how it's done.
On a tangent (only a slight one this time
): When I was stationed in Korea, we would have basewide exercises, including chemical exercises, at least once a quarter (sometimes more often). They would usually last about a week, of which 3 to 5 days of it would be spent wearing chem gear. In the winter it's not quite as bad, but wearing chem gear in 90 degree weather is definitely not fun. Anyways, whenever the exercise would end, there would always be an anouncement over the base Giant Voice system (fancy name for a big PA system) declaring "End of Exercise" or "End Ex" and accompanied by Lee Greenwood's "God Bless the USA".I don't stand and remove my cap when that song is played, like you may have seen people do, and then ignore the National Anthem like some of those same people do
- but I can't help wanting to shout "End Ex" and start peeling off my chem gear every time I hear it. Kind of a Pavlov's Dog thing.
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