Good 8, Evil 9 - Evil wins the Exhibition!

[Gansk]

Lothir will attempt a grapple with his AoO.

 

[Infiniti2000]

Lothir will attempt a grapple with his AoO.

Doesn't the free action move into your opponent's space automatically fail because you cannot take a free action outside your turn?

 

[Gansk]

I thought we allowed AoO grapples in BoAA. Have previous examples been limited to creatures with improved grab?

 

[Infiniti2000]

I thought we allowed AoO grapples in BoAA. Have previous examples been limited to creatures with improved grab?

Probably. Maybe PJSlavner can weigh in on whether it was allowed in the past, but I'm betting he'll say he's not the expert on grappling rules.

IMC, I allow improved grab but not grappling. Per the rules, I think neither is allowed. But, I like the idea of (e.g.) a glabrezu snatching someone out of the air as they try to get by. I don't like the idea of someone moving into their space as they move by. There's a big difference IMO between grappling an improved grab because it makes one side or the other move.

 

[Gansk]

That's OK, I'll change the AoO to a trip.

 

[PJSlavner]

That is correct that I am not an expert in grappling rules, but I thought we did allow grapple attempts as AoOs.

On page 141 of the PHB, disarm, grapple, and trip actions have the superscript 7. In the notes under 7, it states that those actions can be used as attacks of opportunity.

It seems that the rules state the opposite of what Infiniti does: a creature with Improved Grab cannot use Improved Grab to grapple in an AoO because it is a free action, whereas a normal grapple attempt is allowed as an AoO.

I would allow both as an AoO in my campaign, and I am happy that Gansk does, as well, because I was once able to keep a bad guy from running away by using Improved Grab.

I think that Gansk should be allowed to keep the grapple AoO.

Maybe one cannot maintain the grapple because that requires movement, but the grappled creature uses up an entire move action when it is grappled.

 

[Greybar]

Okay, Gansk - which one do you want to choose, given that enlightenment (or confusen-ment ... I'm going to have to reread it again - but what else is new with grapple.)

 

[PJSlavner]

At least grappling is easier than it was in first edition, when you had to figure out your modifiers every time you wanted to grapple.

 

[Greybar]

As much as I may complain (mostly about myself), the good thing about grapple (and many things d20) is that it handles the 80% of cases very well, and if I was running a sit-down game I'd be pretty comfortable bluffing through the other 20% without opening a book or browser to the SRD. Even if I didn't get it quite right, the flow of the game would work out just fine - general rules of opposed rolls and such.

I do feel more in the spotlight here since we all have time to research the rules, but that also means I learn a lot more.

 

[Infiniti2000]

Well, if grappled, Ringo will take the same action as I predicted from a trip. But, either way, you'll have to answer the question of whether an SR check vs. the protection from evil is necessary on the attack of opportunity.