Grade the Savage Worlds System

How do you feel about the Savage Worlds game system?

  • I love it.

    Votes: 32 27.1%
  • It's pretty good.

    Votes: 32 27.1%
  • It's alright I guess.

    Votes: 22 18.6%
  • It's pretty bad.

    Votes: 5 4.2%
  • I hate it.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • I've never played it.

    Votes: 26 22.0%
  • I've never even heard of it.

    Votes: 1 0.8%

I'm not super passionate about it, but I like it and I think it does a pretty good job if you want pulpy action, but also a bit of crunch.
I'm playing in a Savage Worlds/Sprawlrunners game for a while now, and based on that experience I would not only rank it the best way to play a Shadowrun game so far but also consider it for other games roughly in the same spirit (e.g. Deadlands, 50 Fathoms, Savage Hexxen).
I have to say that for classic fantasy, I'm a bit conflicted. I tried running a game with the previous edition and the Hellfrost books, and it didn't really click. But at that time, Savage Pathfinder didn't exist, which is probably the route I would go if I tried the same again today.
Overall, Savage Worlds gets a solid 2/"It's pretty good" from me.
 

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HaroldTheHobbit

Adventurer
Savage Worlds is my main system. Currently I'm running a fantasy city campaign using Savage Pathfinder, it's been going on for little less than a year.

The system fits my style of GMing and home brewed semi sandboxy campaigns perfectly. It's very light on the mechanical prep and is easy to improvise with. SW has crunch, but in actual play it is pretty much transparent. My group love the swingyness and exploding dice chains, it makes for moments of both cheer and dread, and is the opposite of boring hp attrition. Even though death can often be countered by use of the meta-currency, bennies, I as GM have good control of the general feel of deadliness and heroism in how generous I am with the bennies. The premade settings, campaign and adventures are usually of excellent quality, and even though I mainly home-brew they are good reading for inspiration. The system has a very wide frame for playable power levels as has been mentioned - but there are limits.

Even though I personally don't have a problem with it, the system is pressed when reaching really high power levels, like cosmic level superheroes or really high level D&D style heroic fantasy. What stops Savage Worlds from being my only system used though is that it, imho, isn't good for doing really low power, gritty play styles. The system is too pulpy at its core.

My next campaign will be a massive, Traveller-esque sci-fi affair. I'm just waiting for the SW Sci-Fi Companion to be released to start the campaign prep.
 

Reynard

Legend
I feel like people are overstating the potential for "carefully planned encounters to end with one hit." First of all,your BBEG has Bennies, too. And there are wound caps. And they have minions. And toughness. What I mean is if the PCs one shot the BBEG, the encounter was not, in fact, carefully planned.

On top of that SWADE climactic fights are meant to be dramatic and cinematic set pieces. Where is the terrain and moving parts and explosions and tough choices?
 

Retreater

Legend
There’s a couple of simple encounter rules in the Savage Pathfinder that I tend to use across all genres that have served me well.
To be fair, I haven't used those yet. Maybe it will make a difference. I didn't write my own adventure for the Pathfinder one-shot - I ran Hollow's Last Hope from the GM Screen pack.
And that last encounter in the adventure (without getting into spoilers) was a brutal TPK. The villain basically ended up having "mercy" on the party and telling them to leave his lair and spread word of his terror. Otherwise, I would've killed my family on Christmas. Haha.
I don't have high hopes that I can sustain a months-long campaign in Savage. When I try Holler in a few months, I'll see if it can prove me wrong.
I feel like people are overstating the potential for "carefully planned encounters to end with one hit." First of all,your BBEG has Bennies, too. And there are wound caps. And they have minions. And toughness. What I mean is if the PCs one shot the BBEG, the encounter was not, in fact, carefully planned.
I don't often have the trouble of the PCs "one-shotting" the BBEG. They may kill it in 1-2 rounds, which is okay. But the heroes can certainly get dropped very quickly, as Bennies start to run out, their Toughness doesn't scale with the baddies, and a couple of mooks gang up on them with a BBEG batting clean-up.
And while the characters may not outright "die," it's not uncommon for the entire group to be incapacitated, which can easily end the adventure and campaign.
 

Reynard

Legend
I don't often have the trouble of the PCs "one-shotting" the BBEG. They may kill it in 1-2 rounds, which is okay. But the heroes can certainly get dropped very quickly, as Bennies start to run out, their Toughness doesn't scale with the baddies, and a couple of mooks gang up on them with a BBEG batting clean-up.
And while the characters may not outright "die," it's not uncommon for the entire group to be incapacitated, which can easily end the adventure and campaign.
Sure. I was responding to a couple folks talking about the BBEG getting dropped. if the PCs all get incapacitated, it is an opportunity for a death trap or jail break or geas or any number of interesting outcomes besides a TPK.
 


(1) it's swingy. This is either a feature or bug depending on your view point. For me it's a feature. In spite of the swingy nature of exploding dice, it is actually really, really hard to kill a Savage Worlds character. You can put them out of a combat but it's dificult to actually kill them. There are optional rules that can make it easier or harder if you want to utilize them.

It's a feature for me, too, but it definitely means that this otherwise-generic system is only generic for certain styles of play. That's fine for me because I like pulpy action.

(2) High Toughness opponents can be difficult. In some respects this is accurate. There are things you can do to lessen the issue. It can be frustrating for players to swing, hit, and then fail to penetrate the armor/toughness of the bad guy. In my mind it's not different than attritioning meaningless hit points, but I get that it feels different because when hit points are attritioned at least the attacker is doing something.

Yeah, this is an issue that I think they need to address. It does feel like loading your revolver with 5 nerf bullets and one nuclear warhead. Waiting to ace a damage roll isn't fun even if it is tense.

I've seen some people have house rules that every 4 points of toughness over some arbitrary cap (often 11 or 15 toughness) instead results in an additional wound point. It's a decent idea, but I've never tried it.

SWADE is much improved, but this is one area that didn't really change.

(3) Math Bugs - there are some interesting corner case issues with the exploding dice. Notably the d4. It's easier to roll a 5 on a d4 in Savage Worlds than it is on a d6 or any other dice. When the the base difficulty number is a 4, it feels funny. I'll grant that it's a real issue, in that it exists. I don't think it matters because so often you're looking for the raise (+4 over the difficulty number of the roll) to gain an extra effect.

Yeah. The biggest issue is that the math bug is at its worst at kind of a bad breakpoint. The most common dice to roll are d6s and d8s; getting a raise (two successes) requires an 8 or better. Well, it's easier to roll an 8 on a d6 (1/6 * 5/6 = 5/36 = 13.9%) than it is to roll an 8 on a d8 (1/8 = 12.5%). That is an Ace, so it's also true that any raise on a d8 has a 50% chance of being a double raise (three successes) but needing that is often rare. It's a small enough bug that you probably won't notice, but it's still not a feature. You can kinda fix it by simply subtracting 1 from any exploding die... but nobody is gonna do that.

My major complaint is initiative. I hate reshuffling and dealing cards. It's great for Deadlands where the trappings of saloon games are super evocative, but anywhere else they're almost immersion-breaking. The fact that you deal new initiative every turn and have to reshuffle fairly often means it takes a lot of table time just to determine turn order. Having to remember suit order (SHDC) to resolve ties which come up fairly often at a table of 5 (a 40%-50% chance, IIRC) is annoying. And then there's jokers that let players delay and interrupt. None of this initiative system is "fast & furious" to me. And the fact that there are numerous abilities or environmental effects that trigger on face value or suit means that it's hard to homebrew an alternative. I just don't want a game that cares this much about determining turn order.

My other complaint is mostly about PEG. They keep releasing fantasy books and I'm really tired of waiting for the Sci-Fi book to be updated. It's basically untouched since the mid 2000s 2010s and is desperately in need of an update. The KS is due any time, but I'm so tired of waiting only to see them release more fantasy crap when I don't think it's a very good fantasy system.

Edit: Typo
 
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Reynard

Legend
The hardest part about SW to me is remembering to keep handing out bennies. If you don’t the Bennie economy right the game falters. I started handing one to each player at the end of each scene just so I could remember.
When I run Savage Worlds at conventions, I use a variant of the Momentum/Doom pool from 2d20: each PC starts off with 2 bennies (or 3 if they have Lucky) and then there is a pool of Bennies on the table. If they pull from those table Bennies, they become GM Bennies, and when I use them they go back into the player pool. It works great, creates tension and,most importantly, I don't have to remember to give out Bennies.
 

The hardest part about SW to me is remembering to keep handing out bennies. If you don’t the Bennie economy right the game falters. I started handing one to each player at the end of each scene just so I could remember.

We did the same. I had a reminder note on my GM shield to do it. Initially, I tried to award them whenever someone played well, but it got to be too easy to forget. Eventually, I just gave one out to every PC after every scene as long as it felt like the PCs were challenged.

Same problem with Inspiration in D&D.
 

When I run Savage Worlds at conventions, I use a variant of the Momentum/Doom pool from 2d20: each PC starts off with 2 bennies (or 3 if they have Lucky) and then there is a pool of Bennies on the table. If they pull from those table Bennies, they become GM Bennies, and when I use them they go back into the player pool. It works great, creates tension and,most importantly, I don't have to remember to give out Bennies.

That's interesting. Do you use a fixed global pool, then?

One of the problems we had with Doom/Momentum in 2d20 Conan was that you could just overload the GM with Doom. One of the PCs was a berserker that always did a max Doom spend in combat. It became clear that that could be a problem. It didn't happen very often, but we had one session with a lot of combat and the GM looked down and sighed and said, "I have 30 Doom. There's no way I can spend this without killing you guys."

It didn't really bother us, but it was clear that it was basically a broken system as presented.
 

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