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WOIN Grenades

PolloParrington

First Post
Just had a few quick questions regarding the grenade rules on page 96 of NEW:

1) The damage from your average frag grenade is 2d6 (which you can pretty much brush off with some decent armour), and it states they cannot be combined with other ranged exploits unless otherwise noted. Does this mean you can't do your usual 2 Attack Dice > 1 Damage Die exchange when making your attack roll?

2) It states that the grenade makes an attack roll against each creature individually, but it also advises that an empty square has Defence of 10 and to apply damage to any within the grenade's area of effect. Does this mean they're supposed to roll to hit the area first and then make an attack roll against each affected creature? Or do all creatures in the area automatically take damage?
 

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Morrus

Well, that was fun
Staff member
1) Attack dice > damage dice is not an exploit.

2) Make the easy DEF 10 check to hit the square; if miss roll to see which square is hit. Then make an attack roll against each creature in the area.
 

TheHirumaChico

Villager
Sorry for the post-necro, but this one is pretty much exactly on topic for my follow-on questions.

2) Make the easy DEF 10 check to hit the square; if miss roll to see which square is hit. Then make an attack roll against each creature in the area.
I understand that the character makes a ranged attack (AGI or INT dice pool), supplemented by his or her dice pool from the throwing (physical) skill, if any. The first ranged attack is against the targeted square, which is DEF 10. But then presuming the square is hit, what skill dice are used to make the subsequent attack roll against the VITAL DEFENSE of each creature in the Burst radius of the grenade?

It doesn't seem logical to use the same attack skill of the character who threw the grenade, because that was already used to hit the targeted square (or miss it and scatter). To my mind it seems to be the grenade's blast that is making the attack against the creature's VITAL DEFENSE, and not the thrower's lob. So for step 2, does the grenade have an attack value/skill dice pool that should be used?
 

Morrus

Well, that was fun
Staff member
Sorry for the post-necro, but this one is pretty much exactly on topic for my follow-on questions.



I understand that the character makes a ranged attack (AGI or INT dice pool), supplemented by his or her dice pool from the throwing (physical) skill, if any. The first ranged attack is against the targeted square, which is DEF 10. But then presuming the square is hit, what skill dice are used to make the subsequent attack roll against the VITAL DEFENSE of each creature in the Burst radius of the grenade?

It doesn't seem logical to use the same attack skill of the character who threw the grenade, because that was already used to hit the targeted square (or miss it and scatter). To my mind it seems to be the grenade's blast that is making the attack against the creature's VITAL DEFENSE, and not the thrower's lob. So for step 2, does the grenade have an attack value/skill dice pool that should be used?
You won’t like the answer. :)
 

TheHirumaChico

Villager
Um, OK, but I'll still take the bait and ask for further clarification of your somewhat cryptic reply.

Am I right to presume that you are going to say it should use the initial roll to hit the square? Or that the thrower's skill is used again to make the subsequent attacks? I don't know if I won't like those answers, I am just trying to provide a reasonable explanation to my players. I guess the only answer I wouldn't like is if the answer you just gave is the only one you plan to provide ;)

Aside: We played another session of WOIN:NOW this past Saturday, and we generally love the system, BTW. Generally intuitive, appropriate level of crunch, but usually quick to understand allowing for good pace. It's now our "Goldilocks" rules system for my modern covert ops campaign after having tried and discarded five other rules systems prior.

Return to topic at hand: The enemy soldiers opposing my players' team of agents tossed a flash-bang grenade at them, and a discussion ensued. I ended up ruling that the initial skill roll to hit the square would be used for the subsequent check against VITAL DEFENSE in the interest of moving on, but they wanted to revisit the Grenade topic post-session. I said I would ask in the forums and see what came of it.

In the absence of a flash-bang grenade in the WOIN source books, I've home-ruled it as follows:
No damage, but anyone in the Burst 2 radius who is successfully hit by an attack vs. their Vital Defense will suffer the Blind and Deaf conditions at their 2nd stage and as Severe conditions per pp. 173 - 176 of the NEW book. Anyone in Burst 3-4 radius who is successfully hit by an attack vs. their Vital Defense will suffer the Blind and Deaf conditions at their 1st stage. Specific PPE (night-vision goggles with auto-gating technology [If someone was wearing night vision goggles and someone threw a flash bang grenade, how much damage would it do to someone’s vision? - Quora], welder's goggles/face shield, ear plugs) will provide some appropriate immunity to these effects.
 

Morrus

Well, that was fun
Staff member
Um, OK, but I'll still take the bait and ask for further clarification of your somewhat cryptic reply.

Am I right to presume that you are going to say it should use the initial roll to hit the square? Or that the thrower's skill is used again to make the subsequent attacks? I don't know if I won't like those answers, I am just trying to provide a reasonable explanation to my players. I guess the only answer I wouldn't like is if the answer you just gave is the only one you plan to provide ;)
Initial roll. I’m a fan of fast mechanics.
 


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