D&D (2024) Greyhawk Confirmed. Tell Me Why.

[Paul Farquhar]

1. You never meet any Dragonborn
2. You never meet any monks
3. You never fight other Dragonborn or Monks
4. You never find any Dragonborn Magic Items
5. You never find any monk magic items
6. There's no legends or major figures that are Dragonborn or Monks that you can aspire to be like or meet or learn about

That’s great, fantasy is jam packed with unique heroes with special powers that no one else has.

The lesson WotC needs to teach (and not just to new DMs) is “you don’t need to explain everything”.

 

[Reynard]

That’s great, fantasy is jam packed with unique heroes with special powers that no one else has.

The lesson WotC needs to teach (and not just to new DMs) is “you don’t need to explain everything”.

I think the point was that people want their characters to feel part of the world.

 

[Minigiant]

I mean, is it possible that we can at least wait and see what WOTC actually does before asserting our opinions of what we already wanted them to do because we know it won't work?

Look, if we already are assuming that WoTC can't do anything right before we see it, then why are we asking them to do other things that we want ... because, a priori, you know that they won't do it right?

Again I am not saying WOTC can't do anything right.

I am saying that for WOTC and the past D&D IP holder never held it as a priority. And the 2014. DMG is proof of it.

The designers at WOTC could probably do an excellent job at it. But a large swath of the community, which includes many designers, don't see teaching how to design or redesign a setting as an important thing.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

WoTC can't do anything right

This statement is undoubtedly true, since no matter what they do there will be a faction of people who hate it. The idea here is to do as little as possible, thus minimising what people have to object to, whilst trying to show they don’t consider the setting dead.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

Again I am not saying WOTC can't do anything right.

I am saying that for WOTC and the past D&D IP holder never held it as a priority. And the 2014. DMG is proof of it.

The designers at WOTC could probably do an excellent job at it. But a large swath of the community, which includes many designers, don't see teaching how to design or redesign a setting as an important thing.

Well, let me give you my perspective.

First, this is not the absolute ideal thing I wanted for Greyhawk. It's a DMG tutorial, not a full campaign setting. But instead of concentrating on that, I am considering the following-

1. It comes with a map! That is actually pretty cool. That's one of the things I was hoping for. Will it live up to the magic of the Darlene original? Probably not, but I'm giving it a chance.

2. It won't be "over-lored." One of my favorite things about Greyhawk (the original folio and the '83 campaign setting) is that it wasn't stuffed to the gills with lore; instead, it was full of bare descriptions and tantalizing hooks for the DMs to determine how to use. Not to mention plenty of open spaces that begged for adventure. So, in a certain way, having this be a tutorial will ensure that GH will stay as the setting that the Forgotten Realms steals from tables fill in.

Finally, the perfect is the enemy of the good. I am happy that we are going to see it, and will withhold judgement on the implementation until, you know, we actually see it.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

I think the point was that people want their characters to feel part of the world.

In my experience, players want their characters to be quirky and unique. My current group include a pigman, a genetically modified cat and a body in a tank.

 

[Gammadoodler]

Based on the title of the thread, I assume there is a gif missing..I've provided options below..

 

[Remathilis]

Not connecting to the lore. Connection to the setting.

Playing a class or race and it doesn't mean anything.

You make a Dragonborn monk and

1. You never meet any Dragonborn
2. You never meet any monks
3. You never fight other Dragonborn or Monks
4. You never find any Dragonborn Magic Items
5. You never find any monk magic items
6. There's no legends or major figures that are Dragonborn or Monks that you can aspire to be like or meet or learn about

etc etc

Do I expect WOTC to explain or teach new DMs how to introduce dragonborn to Greyhawk or how to make a dragon nation for Greyhawk?

No, I dont see that happening.

That's why it would be better IMHO to either
1) designing a new setting that displays all the PHB content as understood and major aspects of the setting by default
OR
2) Go through the full process of designing an old setting from scratch and explain each step so a new DM or old DM who never did it can learn

1. You don't need a nation of dragonborn for groups of dragonborn to exist. Not every species needs an ethnostate. We assume minotaurs or Yuan ti exist in community-like systems without being part of a recognized nation. There is no giants homeland, no kingdom of goblins. I don't see much difference.
2. Good news! Monks have been a part of Greyhawk since 1e. The Scarlet Brotherhood are infamous for evil monks. Monasteries dedicated to the God of fitness likewise do.
3. Most of the time, you fight monsters anyway, but I don't see a prohibition on dragonborn NPCs or villains and there is a monk like NPC stat block in MotM.
4. That's a part of the magic item section, not Greyhawk.
5. How many famous clerics are there in Greyhawk? Famous dwarves or halflings? Who is the ranger of legend? Outside the Circle of the Eight, Greyhawk isn't exactly known for it's NPCs. It's not Faerun where epic heroes are all over the place. YOU may be the epic dragonborn hero.

 

[TiQuinn]

Not connecting to the lore. Connection to the setting.

Playing a class or race and it doesn't mean anything.

Okay I read what you wrote and between your posts here and elsewhere, you and I just have very different viewpoints of what a setting needs to have and what players want.

 

[Belen]

Good orcs fill the role previously filled by half-orcs.

lol....nope. This is one option I will not use. I assume they are continuing with the idiocy that half-orcs and half-elves pick the traits of either or and I will probably just continue to allow the older options.