Grief over a review

[Teneb]

Hi stuart,

Thanks for coming out and giving us another part of the story.

You trusted this person with playtesting and did not go with his findings about the problems he reported in that role. So when they still existed in the final version why were you hurt by his review? After all it was a review of all the good things the reviewer liked giving it a 4 but with the problems from the playtest keeping it from getting the coveted 5. But still a four out of five is not a bad review.

I really don't have much more to add other than, as a playtester, I missed the aforementioned table error as well. I fell at least partly responsible for it. However, it made it in, and in the interest of a balanced review I felt the need to point it out.

I carry no hard feelings. As someone else stated above, it comes down to two different ways of looking at things. I think BIG's products have been top notch thus far (I wouldn't playtest for them if I thought otherwise) and I really want the company to succeed. Its just clear that I won't be able to be a part of that due to differences in opinion. I'll still buy anything BIG puts out, and I sincerely hope Stuart reconsiders.

 

[Psion]

Teneb? Did you delete the review? It appears to be gone now. If you have done so intentionally (instead of it being a time-delayed message to blacksway), I hope you will reconsider.

Stuart. It's regrettable that you won't be continuing the Darkness Rising line, but I can understand the reason from a business standpoint. As for being emotional -- that is something that anyone in the business has to learn to deal with.

However, I really must take issue with the notion that either Joe or myself "just gave it a score after looking at the pictures." I'll let Joe speak for himself, but that does not sound like him. As for me, I was entranced enough with the setting that I felt compelled to explore and understand the mechanics behind it. That it took so much effort to do was most of my issue with the book. That didn't stop me from giving it a net positive review. Whatever the case, I certainly did not "just skim through it."

 

[Psion]

I think they were warranted (but no one was banned from my site – ever!)

That's not true, but as you informed me later, everyone was for a short while. At the time, I thought you were banning me specifically. But fact was, until I wrote you about it, I was banned.

 

[BSF]

Actually, let's be honest here. It's Bottled Imp Games.

My company.

I'll set the record straight here, as it appears everything has been brought to a head here and all the cards are on the table.

Now everything's in the open, I feel much better about it all.

I may have overreacted about the review.

/*snip*/

Stuart

Stuart, as a potential customer I feel a need to pipe up here.

I'll be honest, I haven't yet bought any of your books. They are on my "buy list", and I just haven't gotten to them yet. I budget myself and I tend to choose books that have the most application for my game at the time. When the Lords of the Night books started coming out, I was just winding down a heavily undead based campaign. One with established material. So, your books have been sitting on my buy list for a while. Actually, the Zombies one is close to pushing me to get the entire series at once.

You might wonder why. It is because of solid reviews. A review does not need to be 5/5 to grab my attention. Actually, I view most 5/5 reviews with a certain amount of skeptism. I'm a cynic in some ways and I will read the lesser reviews long before I read the best. I really want to know what the worst things that somebody has to say about a book are. Looking at the what the reviewers consider to be the worst issues gives me an idea of what I can expect. If I look at a review that is complaining about bad mechanics, then I will also consider what I know about the reviewers stance on mechanics is. If I look at a review complaining about editing style, then I make an assessment on how I like my information presented. If somebody gripes about tables being out of line, or missing bits, then I can determine what that will mean to me, as a customer. As a result, I *despise* reviews that are all fluff with nothing tangible for me to sink my teeth into. I want to hear the good, the bad and the ugly about a product. Once I have read the review, it is then in my hands on what I do with that information. When I hear about somebody being upset over a review, it makes me less inclined to be a customer because it makes me question their motives.

That being said, I think all the reviews of your products have been solid. I have been able to read the reviews and decide if I feel the same way about the points brought up by some of the reviewers. My purchasing decisions for your books have not been negatively affected by any review. It's more a matter of timing and circumstance.

I can understand an attachment to your books. But, you are not going to be able to please 100% of the people 100% of the time. I can understand that this is not an easy market to sell into and that it might be difficult to float a business along. But, I don't think a 4/5 review is bad, nor will it really hurt your sales. I have never looked at a 4/5 review and offhandedly decided I would never buy the product. Nor have I ever looked at a product that only had 5/5 reviews and decided I have to have it based on nothing more than the numbers. The content in the reviews is what matters the most.

Anyway, I just thought a customer viewpoint of reviews might be interesting. It is unfortunate that you feel the need to stop publishing. If that is the best decision for you and Bottled Imp Games, then I so be it. I do appreciate you stopping by to clarify your position. It sounds like a case of overreacting and that is unfortunate. Because really, I do not consider a review of 4/5 to be bad at all. Many, many of of the books I own didn't rate anything better than 4/5.

 

[jeffh]

Stuart;

Besides agreeing with virtually everything Kaleon Moonshae had to say, I really think you need some perspective here. The reviews you've been so critical of were highly positive, four-star reviews! In fact, you have yet to recieve a review of fewer than four stars on EN World, a feat very few companies can match. This fact goes unmentioned in your otherwise reasonable-sounding post, and for good reason - drawing attention to it would make the rest of it look rather silly. I find it extremely difficult to understand why getting reviews most other companies would envy is a problem for you.

 

[Treebore]

I don't think you need to quit publishing, Stuart, but I do think you need to take some time off and re-gain some perspective. You have gotten nothing but 4/5 and 5/5 reviews. If you call that bad and hurtful you really need to regain some perspective. Take some time off and get some realistic perspective.

If you have been publishing these books at a loss, then you really need to quit. Unless you are rich and need a tax write off.

 

[pogre]

I know one person in my gaming group that will be most disappointed that you are leaving the biz - Hairy Minotaur LOVES your stuff. I have not read any of it, but it sounds like you are making a good decision. Sometimes you have to know when to step out of something - it can make you a happier man.

Good luck!

 

[Mr_Nox]

Stuart has been cast in a very bad light here, its testament to his character that he sought to set the record straight, admit he made a mistake and give his opinions here. This certainly isn’t the place to air this kind of grievance but he stepped up and did what any good man would do.

Considering he wrote, edited and typeset the whole book pretty much on his own, it would be hard to prevent a few errors from creeping through, and creatively he must be extremely attached to the book, no excuse for his actions of course but it goes someway to explaining them.

I know Stuart to be a good man and it does greave me to see these kinds of threads, at least when you purchase a Bottled Imp book you know that its a work of passion with someone’s heart and soul poured into it, something that cant be said for a lot of the stuff on the market.

 

[Kichwas]

You gave a 4 out of 5, and they complained?

The company deserves to go under, whoever they are...

Talk about stuck up and snub nosed.

I've given reviews of 1 or 3 to companies I liked, and not heard one complaint. In the specific cases it was deserved, and for the 1 got a public apology over the issue that caused it (because it was oddly one of my three favorite RPGs - it just had a MASSIVE editing goof so disasterous that the book in question needed to be pulled from the market).

If you publish, you have to accept the opinions.

I've given 3's, and then also recommended the product. a 3 is an average book. Or it may be a very good book with a problem that cuts its utility for the purpose it was intended (but still a 3 because it has utility elsewhere).

If every review you give of a certain company is nothing but shiny-happy0bunny-flowers-praise readers will stop trusting you, and then your reviews are meaningless. You need to be fair and impartial or you have no value.


Complaining over a 4?

That company needs to be taken out of business if they have that much of a lack of professional ethics.


If you want a 5 out of me, you have to be the best I'm presently aware of in the given category that got that 5. That of course means that with every passing review I write, my standard for a 5 gets tougher to meet...

That said, I just gave one last night.

 

[trancejeremy]

Thanks for beating a dead horse (or dead Imp), Arcady. Bottled Imp is now out of business - any reason to further bash them?


Anyway, this isn't exactly isolated. I continue to take grief from Green Ronin employees on message boards all the time over my review of Freeport (I didn't like the book - get over it already). I also get a lot of flak from the T20 people.