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GURPS-Share your thoughts

Azgulor

Adventurer
I have to echo Jurgen's thoughts regarding GURPS. It's a very good system that utilized an elegant core mechanic years before D&D3e. Excluding rabid fanboys and haters from either side of the aisle, I'll try to give you an objective assessment.

GURPS gets a bad rap, much the same way D&D does at other sites like RPGNet. It won't ever be all things to all people, but for those who like it, it can handle a wider range of genres than d20 can without modification. This is a dual-edged sword for the game. Some people want to have a single place to go to reference, say, all of your combat rules - regardless of whether it's Stone Age or Space Opera. Others don't want rules on autofire and explosives taking up page count when they're only interested in running a fantasy campaign. It's been my experience that the latter type of gamer takes an all-or-nothing view of the game. Yet they don't bat an eye at having D&D core rulebooks & d20 Modern or other d20 variant even though there is usually a fair amount of repeated text. Why? I suspect because since those rules are scattered amongst various books, they consider it easier to take or leave what you want. Since GURPS was designed to support genre-crossing styles of play, you don't see the separation in different books that you do with d20 (at least in regards to character creation and combat).

What you will see in GURPS supplements are mechanics that supplement the genre or setting and a great deal of GM advice and suggestions. It baffles me that people who have no problem with the metric ton of d20 variant rules on the market cry that GURPS has "too much".

GURPS in play, is extremely quick. In my experience, it's faster than d20 because there are fewer exceptions or special circumstances employed (such as feats, attack of opportunity, etc.). As Jurgen stated, combat is a more visceral & dramatic affair. There's no D&D hit point "what does it represent" ambiguity. Called shots, hit locations, etc. are built into the core rules as advanced options. Does your critically wounded hero fight on through the pain? In GURPS he does, but in d20 (or at least D&D) he runs at peak efficiency until he drops unconscious. GURPS seems to keep my players on the edge of their seat more. Massive Damage and Wounds/Vitality help d20 get close to the level of tension, but not quite 100% there. My group has often said that GURPS plays out like a novel, while D&D plays out like a video game.

On the other hand, d20 has gone a long way to getting closer to GURPS in its ability to support multiple genres. However, rather than doing so via a Generic System approach, d20 can be tweaked, massaged, or hammered into the appropriate style desired to support a campaign or genre. D&D3/3.5 was still D&D to me - with all of the baggage that caused me to abandon it. D20 Modern, Spycraft, Conan, and Grim Tales showed me how versatile the system can be. Also, the classes-as-archetypes are a much easier learning curve for new players and for player improvement in general. Hit Die and levels are easier GM tools to work with when creating adventures than point totals.

If GURPS has an Achilles' Heel, it's that all that detail can result in long character creation times. As work and family demands continue to eat into available GM prep time, d20's faster character creation and "building block" levels shave 25-50% on character creation. Note: this is a self-inflicted problem. I like fully-statted NPCs (at least for tier 1 & 2 characters). I recently purchased GURPS Character Assistant - it's been the greatest time-saver I've purchased all year.

I still go back and forth between GURPS and Conan as to which is my preferred system. At the end of the day, they're both great games.

Azgulor
 

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Romnipotent

First Post
I play it each week (4th ed) and the system allows for a more personalised character. They're easier to get into because you cannot be typeclassed. I had a 3rd ed character convert over to 4th edition... he had a high intelligence and ended up at about 180 pts 4th from a 100pt 3rd... then he died.
 

HeapThaumaturgist

First Post
I'd like to try GURPS, but them dang short rounds:

Is there any option in the core rules for running rounds where more gets DONE? The slowest game I ever played was GODLIKE, and it had the simplest rounds-mechanic in that your roll to DO an action was the same as WHEN you got to go, and each round was a single action. It took hours to tally and compare and resolve and rinse and repeat ad nauseum.

--fje
 

Nomad4life

First Post
maggot said:
Let me second Mutants&Masterminds as a terrific generic system. I'm working with a friend on creating a cyberpunk game out of it, and it's working great. (If my friend had suggested GURPS cyberpunk, I would have fled in terror.)


Hey yeah! We pretty much did the same thing: M&M has became our “default” generic system on accident. It just runs generic settings so well on short notice, and it's an amazing system to start with.

Back on-topic:
I remember playing GURPS in high school… I remember thinking “this should be fun. The rules are solid. The characters are interesting and detailed. The setting is cool. So why is nobody enjoying themselves? Why do I feel like I’m doing math homework instead of playing a game?”

In other words, I can’t say that the system was “bad” but somehow things never clicked in a good way. Maybe the system was just too tedious to be enjoyable for us at that time.

But like everyone else says, GURPS makes the finest sourcebooks that I know of.
 

Jürgen Hubert

First Post
Dannyalcatraz said:
Well, it would have to be.

I never said that you couldn't run anything with the basic set, just that the supplements were often wildly incompatible with the basic rules. I see that as a severe flaw.

In all honesty, I made several enjoyable PCs in my time playing GURPS. But compared side to side, even at the same point value, they were truly incompatible. This indicated to me that the rules were in a constant state of flux- something that bothers the hell out of me.

That was because GURPS 3e had a very long run - 15 years or so - and various supplements covered various topics that hadn't been treated in the Basic Set. Eventually, the two GURPS Compendia were published and collected all those materials - but too little effort was done in balancing all those systems with each other.

GURPS 4e is different. It's finally a unified system again, it covers pretty much anything you might need for creating a character - any kind of character - and there is finally balance in all things.
 


Kumaiti

First Post
I LOVE GURPS, to me it is the best system ever!!

But I am kind of a "fanboy" for GURPS, so I won't argue about it because it would be quite biased. Just my 0,02
 

Aus_Snow

First Post
Azgulor said:
My group has often said that GURPS plays out like a novel, while D&D plays out like a video game.
Never really found that to be so.

However, I wouldn't be too surprised if the way that GURPS books tend to be written might push away certain demographics. They have more of the novel to them in that way, I suppose. In like manner, the way D&D (as in 'official') books tend to be written might repel others. I've read statements to that effect on other forums, for instance. . . actually, on this one too. :\




Numion said:
If a game plays like a novel, I'd rather go read one.
What then is a good Story Hour thread (one that might somewhat resemble a good novel, let's say)?




Kumalti said:
I am kind of a "fanboy" for GURPS, so I won't argue about it because it would be quite biased.
Just like everyone else's posts, you mean? :p
 

Azgulor

Adventurer
Numion said:
If a game plays like a novel, I'd rather go read one.

So by the same token, you'd rather play a video game than play D&D?

It was probably poor word choice on my part, but that was why I said "play out" rather than "play". When the session is complete, the feedback I've received is that the players weren't pulled out of the role-playing experience due to some wonky game mechanic or abstracted rule.

As an example, I've noticed that when people write up their D&D story hours, they detail the character injuries from combat, etc. Many of the writers are quite gifted and it reads like a novel as you'd expect. However, the writer is filling in the blanks regarding wound detail, the pain the characters fight through, etc. The game doesn't provide for that level of detail.

In D&D, a character won't fight valiantly through a battle and then pass out afterwards from blood loss, or defeat a foe via a well-aimed strike that leaves them alive but disadvantaged (say from serious arm or leg wound). Conversely, you won't see a character in GURPS jump off a three story building because he "knows he can take the hit" or take on 12 orcs without serious reservations. Now which one sounds more like every fantasy novel and movie ever made and which one sounds like Diablo?

Now a d20 variant or OGL game can be a different discussion. Conan/Grim Tales/Spycraft vs. GURPS - tough choice. D&D vs. GURPS - GURPS wins for me every time.

Azgulor
 

Nebulous

Legend
I've never played GURPS but i like what i'm hearing about the supplements. Those that enjoy them, what would you say are the top five supplement books out there? And are they generic enough to be applied to a d20 game, or any other system?
 

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