Has anyone managed to make the monk less oriental?

[fusangite]

Please, can you post a link?
Thanks.

http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=125195

 

[Telas]

In one homebrew, I explained monks as being advocates of Greek-style philosophical schools with knowledge of Pankration and the workings of the universe to explain their abilities. I had trouble finding a decent class name, I ended up just calling them "Philosophers" but that didn't do a good job of conveying the class.

Stoics.

Telas

 

[Krieg]

And I've made Vikings less-inclined to wear hats w/horns.

I hope you are aware of the sweet irony of that statement.

 

[Oberyn]

Gez out of all the posts here (no offence to the others) i find your most helpfull of anything... although i may let them switch weapons (same kind just a different one) but only if its ordained and blessed by a high priest of thier order.

 

[ecliptic]

The only things that need to be changed is the Ki powers and the weapons given to the Monk class. Give him these weapons: Club, crossbow (light or heavy), flail, halberd, longspear, long sword, rapier, shortspear, shortsword, spear, quarterstaff, and sling.

Anyway here is some quotes from the link I posted earlier.

The Landsknecht had to learn martial skills on a private basis. Units were established only for a short time of weeks or a few months and there was nearly no regular training until the early 17th century. The men lived in small villages, as poor peasants. At about 12 years old the boys learned the martial arts from the older men at their villages. They had a full scheme, including empty hand techniques (a form of grappling that resembles Jiu Jutsu), and fencing with the short sword, the pike and the halberd.

The halberd was the other most important military weapon. It was applied against other infantry and in close-range combat against fallen horsemen. The training happened when there was time, in the evenings and on Sundays after church. It consisted of sports to build general fitness, and fencing lessons (the term "fencing" was used much like "Kung Fu" (Gongfu) in China and included empty-hand and weapons techniques). The elder taught the younger and some elders became respected and famous masters. The relation of masters, elder, and younger students was very similar to that in China and it was the regular scheme in all arts. The knights had their scheme of honor and deep roots in Christian traditions and thinking. The new forces derived their rules from craftsmanship. Even today German craftsmen (carpenters, butchers, etc.) are divided into students ("Lehrlinge"), junior advanced craftsmen after 3-4 years of education ("Junggesellen"), senior advanced craftsmen ("Altgesellen"), and masters ("Meister"). It is expected that a junior will learn with different masters at different places in order to expand his practical experience and to become a senior. Only the master is allowed to teach students and to open his own business. Remarkable, if compared to the social structure in the Asian defensive traditions. Starting in the late 16th century, German Landsknechts had to provide evidence for an education from a noted master. Like in Asia, the martial arts lineage of a fighter became important for both quality control and his reputation.

The martial art of the Landsknechts was remarkably similar to Asian fighting traditions. Most of the knowledge is lost but what we learn from rare ancient books that have been handed down to our time is a surprise. The empty-hand techniques resembled what we know as Jiu Jutsu and included additional techniques that we commonly see in modern grappling. European fighters would have matched well against Asian opponents. Remember that most boxing styles (karate, most Gongfu) were not really applied on the military battlefields. In armed combat empty hand techniques are needed when the opponent had already bridged the gap to close quarters. A man had lost his weapon and had to continue the defence, kill the enemy and grab the weapon again. He may have got stuck in armed fighting, given up the weapon and ended the fight with a lethal throw. Throwing an opponent means to let him fall on the head, break the spine or bring him to the ground where you could kill him fast with the knife that every man had on his side. Battles were fast and there was not much time for long duels. It could take only three hours until 20,000 men on the other side were killed.

Link again
http://www.practical-martial-arts.co.uk/practical_martial_arts/hh_landsnecht.html

 

[focallength]

the closest I ever got to a non-oriental monk was a Irish cleric in second edition who focused on unarmed combat (boxing). I guess an Irish cleric / monk would be just about the same. Fighting Irish ring a bell?

 

[Klaus]

Oh, and Shadowrun has it's own non-Oriental monkish tradition: the Physical Adept.

 

[SWBaxter]

Stoics.

That was one of the schools I used, but not the only one so it wouldn't have made a good name for the class as a whole. I could've made it so that was the only philosophy that lead to monk-like abilities, but the idea of rival academies resolving philosophical disputes Streetfighter-style was just too fun to give up.

 

[VirgilCaine]

How about "Arcane Internalist?" Use precisely the same mechanics, but change all the naming references -- ki shout, dance of a thousand petals, diamond soul, whatever -- to arcane-sounding terms.

The basic concept is something like this: The wizard has to study spells, a sorcerer has innate access to magic but he still has to cast spells, the warlock taps into magical effects without spells, and the internalist's connection to mana is the most elemental level of all -- every act he performs is almost arcane, fueled by unshaped magic itself. His body is the spell.

I had this thought just the past day or two--they are basically sorcerors but even more innate and limited in their magic. They're just humans turned up to eleven. They jump, run, punch, wrestle, kick, survive better than humans.

I like the idea of a Greek-type monk--wandering phiolosophers that champion human power, not deific power...
Imagine a group of monks, sorcerors and wizards who try to prove how good humans can be without the help of a deity.

One group claims that the Monk is derived entirely from Asian mythology, and doesn't fit most Western European-flavored campaigns. Which conveniently forgets the Scarlet Brotherhood in Greyhawk, one of the oldest campaign settings out there.

IIRC, it's the original campaign setting.

 

[Telas]

Well, dangit, I went and did it.

I just changed my House Rules document to add the following:

The Monk class is limited to only Humans, who must forego their extra feat at 1st level. Otherwise, class and race combinations are not officially proscribed, but a Dwarven Wizard or Elven Barbarian had better have a good background.

Thanks to everyone on this thread who chimed in. I'm using a lot of your ideas, such as the Human Paragon (Humanist? Human Idealist? Nah).

Rationale:

Game Balance - I run a fairly low-magic campaign. Monks are holy terrors in that type of setting. Forcing them to be Humans and Nerfing them a bit helps to restore some of that balance.

Setting I - Greyhawk is built on the D&D and AD&D systems, in which only Humans could be Monks. This restores some of that original feel. On the other hand, I use the Paladin variants and allow any race to become a Paladin.

Setting II - Monk abilities are explained by the "Human Paragon" model. Regardless of their actual philosophy (Scarlet Brotherhood, Order of the Wing, School of the Intercepting Fist, etc), they acheive their abilities by becoming "more Human than Human" (with apologies to White Zombie).

Telas