Has Paizo ever talked about releasing their adventures in 5E format?

[billd91]

They're also human, and humans do silly things.Thirteen years ago, WotC almost killed their business by taking away Dragon magazine. They barely recovered but a year later WotC hit them again by announcing 4e. Then WotC cut them out of the loop by not showing them the game they were working on, leaving the company floundering. Then they turned the company around and became the biggest name in the industry. Only to be left in the dust when WotC brought D&D back.

So you're thinking that third time might be the charm and if Paizo becomes dependent on WotC-alliance revenue again, the next time WotC pivots on a business decision it'll finally kill them for good? Because that's kind of what it sounds like...

 

[CapnZapp]

So you're thinking that third time might be the charm and if Paizo becomes dependent on WotC-alliance revenue again

There is no other revenue stream.

If Paizo sticks to it's decision to cut loose, which might make sense from a typically narcissisticly corporate point of view, they'll be relegated to the tier where... every publisher except WotC is.

Which means, a considerably downsized Paizo, a mere shadow of it's Pathfinder days.

 

[Jester David]

So you're thinking that third time might be the charm and if Paizo becomes dependent on WotC-alliance revenue again, the next time WotC pivots on a business decision it'll finally kill them for good? Because that's kind of what it sounds like...

No.
I’m saying they should have done limited products to take advantage of D&D having it’s best year ever (for the third year in a row) to cheaply produce some high interest books to sustain the development of their new edition and grow the audience of their Adventure Paths and campaign setting.
To actively try and sway D&D players to Pathfinder, or a least get them buying their AP volumes and campaign sourcebooks.

After all, what’s their plan right now? Compete with D&D at its strongest and try to pull players away from the game when it’s becoming a cultural phenomena?
C’mon.
Paizo’s strategy was “a rising tide floats all boats”. Which is STILL dependant on D&D, as it’s relying on WotC to not only bring in more games, but bring in gamers amendable to Pathfinder. But said “rising tide” really hadn’t been the case for any games of late. The market is booming but other systems aren’t doing super well. John Wick went under and Evil Hat pretty much went on life support.

And the massive new audience brought in by steaming is much more focused on story and less on combat, but heavy crunchy combat is the spine of the Pathfinder RPG. In two to five years, when a wave of 5e players tires of that system and itches for something new and different, they probably won’t choose Pathfinder.

Right now, Paizo is the Golarion company. It’s their tent pole. It’s what makes them unique. AND a big campaign hardcover is the kind of product WotC seems uninterested in doing.
They should have done a 5 update of their world. Updates select class options and monsters, while making their bi-monthly campaign setting products more system neutral to appeal equally to players of 5e, PF1, and PF2.

Instead... they chose to compete against 5e AND their first edition.

I mean... I love Paizo. They’re a great company full of great people. But I haven’t had a reason to support them in four years (and should have stopped supporting them earlier than that given how unhappy my last few purchases from them made me).
I WANT to give them my money. And, previously, their attitude was always “if you make products people want, they will give you money for them”. But they’re really opposed to taking the money of the people calling out for 5e conversions.

If Monte Cook can support Numenera and do 5e books... if Green Ronin can do Fantasy Age and do 5e books... why can’t the much larger company that is Paizo do the same?

 

[Morrus]

They're also human, and humans do silly things.Thirteen years ago, WotC almost killed their business by taking away Dragon magazine. They barely recovered but a year later WotC hit them again by announcing 4e. Then WotC cut them out of the loop by not showing them the game they were working on, leaving the company floundering. Then they turned the company around and became the biggest name in the industry. Only to be left in the dust when WotC brought D&D back. It's hard not to feel bitter when competition that wronged you repeatedly is busy lapping you.

We know who they are. It's a small industry. I reiterate that I do not believe that Lisa Stevens, Erik Mona, etc. are the people you seem to be characterising them as.

 

[Jester David]

I have immense respect for them both as well. I can't even count the number of "Auntie Lisa Story Hour"s I've listened to.

But you read the forums here. How many people have been GAGGING for more short adventures. A huge campaign setting book. Content not set in the Realms. More crunch options and denser tactical play.
Y'know, the stuff Paizo excels at.

I don’t expect it from every company. It wouldn’t work for Fantasy Flight Games as all their modern art is Star Wars. But every piece of art for Pathfinder works for 5e. And that’s a sizable cost of producing books.

There's a huge audience for 5e. Right now, the Humblewood kickstarter (https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/hitpointpress/humblewood-campaign-setting-for-5e-dnd) just broke a million dollars moving more than 10k copies, and it's an unknown world by largely unknown creators by a first time publisher. And look at the success of Tome of Beasts and Creature Codex by Kobold Press.
A 5e book written by Paizo would basically be a licence to publish money.

What's a GOOD reason they haven't done something?
Especially in the last couple years when their in-house production dropped for PF2 and they were relying on freelancers anyway. They could have easily done a 5e book or two.

The demand is there, as seen by the half dozen threads asking for conversions and wondering this very question.

 

[pogre]

What's a GOOD reason they haven't done something?
Especially in the last couple years when their in-house production dropped for PF2 and they were relying on freelancers anyway. They could have easily done a 5e book or two.

I believe Morrus has given you THE reason for their business choice. It is a good one from their perspective. That's the only reason they need.

Further, I think folks are underestimating the backlash from the PF community. Rational or not, they would feel betrayed in a sense if Paizo made this move. Alienating the hardcore followers of their line is simply not worth the possible short term monetary gain.

 

[Jester David]

I believe Morrus has given you THE reason for their business choice. It is a good one from their perspective. That's the only reason they need.

What? That sales of their Pathfinder Core Rulebook would suffer?
I don't buy that. It seems like a stretch.

That implies that people are buying and playing Pathfinder rather than 5e because they want to play Pathfinder adventures but find conversion too hard.
Yeah... Nope. Just running Pathfinder is significantly harder and requires more prep than converting adventures to 5e.
Or it implies there's an audience that loves Paizo but is holding off switching to 5e because they want Paizo's permission & approval. Which seems even more unlikely…. Yeah, people are fans and like to support their team, but they're not likely to keep playing a game they're not enjoying just to support a company.

People buy the CRB because they want to play Pathfinder. Not because they don't have options.

And, again, this would be a potential investment. Doing conversions of new adventures would encourage people to buy those, increasing sales of those products that—unlike the CRB—would still be trying to recoup their cost.
And it gets money from people who already swapped over to 5e and bought the CRB. I'm debating converting Carrion Crown to 5e and running that sometime. But if I could just drop $10-20 and get a slick PDF from Paizo that did all the work for me, I would. Happily.

Further, I think folks are underestimating the backlash from the PF community. Rational or not, they would feel betrayed in a sense if Paizo made this move. Alienating the hardcore followers of their line is simply not worth the possible short term monetary gain.

I think you’re overestimating the number of Pathfinder & Paizo fans that are edition warriors. That’s a small, small subset of the audience typically localized to message boards.

Also, if the fans are that fickle and willing to abandon Paizo the SECOND they publish something for 5e, then they're probably not the most reliable fans. It’s not good to cater to an audience willing to blackmail you like that.
They’re not the people you want championing your game. Is that the kind of gamer you want representing your game in game stores? Being the face of your system to newcomers?

Paizo would be better off without fans like that.

Plus, this is also overlooking the many members of the Pathfinder community who reluctantly stopped buying Paizo products because they weren't selling anything they wanted. I loved giving my money to the company, because they were this great open, friendly, and accessible community that seemed focused on improving the industry. I'd love to buy more stuff from them, but I'm not a charity. I've bought too many gamebooks I'll never use (with a good four or five big $40 hardcovers from Paizo alone). But 5e Paizo adventures are a must-buy.

 

[amethal]

I'm debating converting Carrion Crown to 5e and running that sometime. But if I could just drop $10-20 and get a slick PDF from Paizo that did all the work for me, I would. Happily.

Are you proposing they convert the whole of the adventure path in return for your ten dollars, or would it be ten dollars per instalment?

Since (I assume) most of the monsters in Carrion Crown do not currently exist in 5th edition then they might as well release a 5e bestiary while they are at it.

There's no chance of anything at the moment, since they are quite busy with pathfinder 2, but who knows what they might do in the future. (The Rise of the Runelords anniversary hardback was a one off and there were excellent reasons for never doing another one, which they repeated every time someone asked about it, but Curse of the Crimson Throne still got the same treatment eventually.)

 

[Kaodi]

There is a correlated question here which I wonder if it has ever been discussed behind the scenes: If D&D is doing so well and making money hand over fist has it ever offered to just buy Paizo and bring that obviously superior adventure writing ethos in house?

 

[zztong]

I believe Morrus has given you THE reason for their business choice. It is a good one from their perspective. That's the only reason they need.

No doubt. They've got every right to play the game of life as they see it and

Further, I think folks are underestimating the backlash from the PF community. Rational or not, they would feel betrayed in a sense if Paizo made this move. Alienating the hardcore followers of their line is simply not worth the possible short term monetary gain.

Well there's "backlash", I'll say consequences, for every change. I'm looking at a 50% conversion rate to PF2 with my local, tiny, sample of games.

Game 1 involves around 8 players, of which 3 buy PF1 rules and 1 buys APs; 2 plan to buy PF2 rules and 1 plans to buy APs.
Game 2 involves 6 players, of which 5 buy PF1 rules and 2 buy APs; 0 plan to buy PF2 rules, but 2 may purchase APs if easy to convert to PF1.

Net change:
8 PF1 Rules Customers => 2 PF2 Rules Customers
3 PF1 AP Customers => 3 PF2 AP Customers if AP easily converted to PF1 or 1 if not.
None of the games are planning to convert to D&D 5e, though Game 1 has some D&D 5e players.
The local game store only has 5e organized play.

This is why I think selling Paizo APs to PF1, PF2, and 5e customers is the way to go. The PF2 brand is already weak.