Has the DM fallen from grace?

[FireLance]

I wasn't talking about video games in that regard. Playing D&D by yourself would be like playing Chess by yourself.

Except that playing without a DM is not the same as playing D&D by yourself. You can still game, in a group, without one person taking on the DM role.

 

[malraux]

You still don't seem to get it. A party that has no magic at all is going to get a breath weapon immediately.

A party that has anything magical coming from them changes things a bit.

The idea that a party would be tackling a dragon capable of casting any spells without even a single magic item is ludicrous. Spell casting starts at about CR 8. There's no way a 3e party would attempt a CR 8 encounter with no magical effects going.

 

[Mallus]

I don't feel like I've fallen from grace. When I run a game I still dwell in that exalted, semi-divine state, the Viking Hat-shaped Crown of Glory adorning my admittedly rather swelled head.

(I still run campaigns in a high-trust environment. I still enjoy the freedom to simply make up as much shi stuff as I want.)

This hasn't changed appreciably in the last decade while running 3e, 4e, and now AD&D.

 

[FireLance]

The idea that a party would be tackling a dragon capable of casting any spells without even a single magic item is ludicrous. Spell casting starts at about CR 8. There's no way a 3e party would attempt a CR 8 encounter with no magical effects going.

Ah, but a good 3e DM would still want to know what would happen if a low-level party of NPCs encounters the dragon.

 

[malraux]

Ah, but a good 3e DM would still want to know what would happen if a low-level party of NPCs encounters the dragon.

The dragon would just assume that any magic items worth keeping would make their saving throw?

 

[ForeverSlayer]

Except that playing without a DM is not the same as playing D&D by yourself. You can still game, in a group, without one person taking on the DM role.

Actually it is. Sit down at a 4th edition game by yourself or with a group of people without a DM. Now, which one of you controls the monsters?

Who ever starts using those monsters becomes the DM even if it is for just a few moments. Also, whoever controls the monsters has to look at the monster's stats and control them. Now, the whole purpose of the combat is strategy, just like in chess, you can't play by yourself. Well you can certainly try but it defeats the whole purpose.

What about when there are traps that only the DM is supposed to know the location of and you have to look at the grid. After the first time you look at the grid you then know the location of all traps in the room and it spoils the whole thing.

You are just arguing now for the hell of it.

 

[ForeverSlayer]

The dragon would just assume that any magic items worth keeping would make their saving throw?

There is nothing more greedy than a dragon.

 

[Raikun]

A party that has no magic at all is going to get a breath weapon immediately.

A party that has anything magical coming from them changes things a bit.

Then what you *should* have said was along the lines of "a dragon only needs one round to see if there's any magic present."

That, however, is not what you said. You specifically said first round is what is magical and what isn't", and when called out on that you moved the goalposts to a description including "3 rounds before combat starts", and when reminded that FireLance originally pointed out that assumes combat doesn't immediately start, moved the goalposts again to one in which Detect Magic would be almost universally meaningless.

 

[ForeverSlayer]

Then what you *should* have said was along the lines of "a dragon only needs one round to see if there's any magic present."

That, however, is not what you said. You specifically said first round is what is magical and what isn't", and when called out on that you moved the goalposts to a description including "3 rounds before combat starts", and when reminded that FireLance originally pointed out that assumes combat doesn't immediately start, moved the goalposts again to one in which Detect Magic would be almost universally meaningless.

Nope. I said exactly what I meant. I never said anything about in the middle of combat. All I stated was how useful Detect Magic can be in a situation. If someone jumped the gun and thought combat had already started then that was their fault.

All the dragon needed to know was if there is a presence of magic or not.

 

[Raikun]

Playing without a DM

This might seem to be strange advice for a Dungeon
Master’s Guide, but it’s entirely possible to play D&D
without a Dungeon Master. If all you’re looking for
is fun and exciting combat, with no more than the
barest hint of plot or purpose, a random dungeon with
a random encounter deck is all you need. Someone
needs to prepare the deck, and someone needs to run
the monsters during the game. They doesn’t need to be
the same person. All the players can decide together
what the monsters do, and let the player who’s the
target of an attack make that attack roll (or have the
person to the left roll for the monsters).

FireLance is correct, that is not the same as playing chess by yourself.