D&D 5E Healing, range and action economy

[Chocolategravy]

This didn't bother me in 4e, because only PCs were built like PCs, but I have found it a problem in 5e where every Novice Priest NPC can spam infinite attack cantrips. It definitely harms world-building for lower magic settings. In general the PC classes have too many spells for all but the most exceptional NPCs, so I'm looking at building most NPCs very differently, with far more restricted casting and much less combat magic.

I like how level 1-3 are apprentice levels so the free interns who carry your torch, polish your armor and make the coffee also are able to keep the party blessed and toss healing word to stand unconscious people back up.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

This didn't bother me in 4e, because only PCs were built like PCs, but I have found it a problem in 5e where every Novice Priest NPC can spam infinite attack cantrips. It definitely harms world-building for lower magic settings. In general the PC classes have too many spells for all but the most exceptional NPCs, so I'm looking at building most NPCs very differently, with far more restricted casting and much less combat magic.

NPC's arent built like PC's in 5th edition either. Notice how medium "wizards" in the Monster Manual all use d8 hit dice (because they are medium sized). The NPC priest is technically a "monster" so relevant in a fight, but not meant to be indicative of world building.

They have whatever characteristics you deem fit. NPC clerics don't have cantrips or even spells if you don't want them to. This isnt Mathfinder where you have to show your work on a damn spreadsheet for NPC's.

 

[LapBandit]

I just wanted to chime in with a few things I've changed in my campaign regarding healing/0 HP/etc :
Cure Wounds dice are maxed out of combat.
0HP is a Lingering Wound and 1 level of Exhaustion.

Those two things are all I needed to balance it out.

 

[The Crimson Binome]

NPC's arent built like PC's in 5th edition either. Notice how medium "wizards" in the Monster Manual all use d8 hit dice (because they are medium sized). The NPC priest is technically a "monster" so relevant in a fight, but not meant to be indicative of world building.

This is a matter to simplify bookkeeping. The real wizards and priests, out in the world, do have infinite cantrips and larger or smaller hit dice, as you would expect based on the relevant PC class. The game stats don't reflect that particular reality, because it would be a lot of work, so they take broad generalizations and simplify out their powers into what is most likely to be relevant.

A wizard PC and a wizard NPC both represent the same reality within the game world. The only difference is that the PC is reflected in greater resolution.

 

[Tony Vargas]

"No negative hp" seems like just such a stupidly bad rule to me. "Heal from Zero" is a bad rule for most sorts of D&D.

It's mostly just simplified bookkeeping.

Heal from Zero also makes waiting for your allies to drop before healing them a good tactic, kinda the flip side of focusing fire. Otherwise, it doesn't matter as much when you heal them, but not letting them drop might save them an action, depending on how initiative shook out. Heal from Zero thus slightly favors the players, as it 'wastes' monster damage, and avoids 'wasting' in-combat healing on a character who doesn't get hit for the rest of the fight.

No negative hps - just death saves & failed death saves for being hit while dying - is also just bookkeeping reduction. It really doesn't make much of a difference, but it means Healing from Zero, while negative hps can be healed back, or Healed from Zero.

But, neither are 'bad rules,' they're as functional (and as wildly unrealistic) as any other death/dying rule D&D has ever used, and simpler than some of 'em. And, like all 5e rules, they're just a starting point for the DM. Have to start somewhere, afterall.

If you want the advantages of Heal from Zero, you might as well go No Negative hps, and simplify your bookkeeping. If you want death at a certain negative hp total, you might want to do away with death saves or have a failed death save inflict a point of damage, instead of tracking them separately - but you can go with Hf/Z or not.

 

[S'mon]

NPC's arent built like PC's in 5th edition either. Notice how medium "wizards" in the Monster Manual all use d8 hit dice (because they are medium sized). The NPC priest is technically a "monster" so relevant in a fight, but not meant to be indicative of world building.

They have whatever characteristics you deem fit. NPC clerics don't have cantrips or even spells if you don't want them to. This isnt Mathfinder where you have to show your work on a damn spreadsheet for NPC's.

I agree, it doesn't have to be a big problem in 5e. I've already started giving Cleric type NPCs a few specific abilities (eg cure wounds 3/day) instead of full pc class casting.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

This is a matter to simplify bookkeeping. The real wizards and priests, out in the world, do have infinite cantrips and larger or smaller hit dice, as you would expect based on the relevant PC class. The game stats don't reflect that particular reality, because it would be a lot of work, so they take broad generalizations and simplify out their powers into what is most likely to be relevant.

A wizard PC and a wizard NPC both represent the same reality within the game world. The only difference is that the PC is reflected in greater resolution.

Again, at the DM's option. If you want to give the local priest 3 Hit Points, 1 cantrip and 2 spells of 3rd level or lower per short rest, go for it. Or only let them perform rituals with no spell slots. or just be 3HP schlubs with faith and no magical abilities.

PC rules need not reflect the world (see also Death saves), particularly if it impacts the world you want to portray. If it breaks it to have every acolyte be granted unlimited cantrips... don't give them that ability.

My apologies for the diversion. To bring it back around...

Yeah, Healing Word is just so much better than Cure Wounds, there is no contest. Bonus and Range beats a small average HP bump, particularly since 1 is all it takes to get a party member vertical and fighting.

 

[MoutonRustique]

Quick idea - when you get healed from 0, you have disadvantage on everything until the end of your next turn. Considering the speed of combat, that seems an non-negligible penalty with almost no bookkeeping required and no "very, very hard to remove effect" like imposing exhaustion.

Or make it "save ends" (w/ the disadvantage, of course) - that will certainly motivate them to avoid falling to 0!

 

[S'mon]

This is a matter to simplify bookkeeping. The real wizards and priests, out in the world, do have infinite cantrips and larger or smaller hit dice, as you would expect based on the relevant PC class. The game stats don't reflect that particular reality, because it would be a lot of work, so they take broad generalizations and simplify out their powers into what is most likely to be relevant.

A wizard PC and a wizard NPC both represent the same reality within the game world. The only difference is that the PC is reflected in greater resolution.

That's a GM decision, not some kind of Platonic reality. The rules aren't the physics of the game world unless you want them to be. That is as true for magic as for broken bones and lingering injuries. Currently for my 5e campaign I'm inclined to say the pcs are very unusual, almost as exceptional as in 4e, and most npc casters don't look anything much like pc casters - npc barbarians don't much resemble the pc class either.

 

[Tony Vargas]

That's a GM decision, not some kind of Platonic reality. The rules aren't the physics of the game world unless you want them to be.

In a way, rules are the de facto laws of physics for an RPG world. Of course, it depends on how consistently those rules are applied. 5e encourages rulings over rules and DM empowerment, so the DM who makes many off the cuff rulings can really undermine the rule-as-laws-of-physic conceit, much the the consternation of players like Saelorn. It's a little like 4e, that way, in that in 4e rules, though clear and consistent, were decoupled from 'fluff.' Conversely, in the RAW-uber-alles zeitgiest of 3.x, rules were very much the laws of physics.