[HELP!] Low AC, High Damage group

[Noldor Elf]

I decided to ask a little bit of advice for behalf of out DM:

Our 9-10th level D&D group, for quite low magic Forgotten Realms has mostly less equipment than suggested in DMG. However our weapons are at least adequate for our level. Our group:

Dwarf Fgt 9
Heavy Mace +2, two handed, dmg 1d8+11 (Wep. Spec.)
AC 17 (Masterwork Breastplate)
HP: 94

Elf Rng 8/Rog 1
Longsword +1 (vampiric), dmg 1d8+5(+1d6) (primary)
Shortsword +2, speed, dmg 1d6+4(+1d6) (off-hand)
AC 18 (Masterwork Leather)
HP: 89

Elf Drd 8/Rng 1/Prc 1
Longsword +1 (flaming), dmg 1d8+3+1d6 (primary)
Shorsword +1, dmg 1d6+2 (off-hand)
AC 17 (Wooden Chain Shirt) / 19 (Shield +1)
HP: 67

Dwarf Brb2/Fgt5
Battleaxe +2 (flaming), dmg 1d12+11+1d6 / 1d12+14+1d6 (raging)
AC 15 (Chain mail)
HP: 76

As you can see, we have quite high damage potential, but quite low damage taking capacity.

What are your suggestions: preferable suggestions to improve group's damage taking capacity (in low magic, especially no tailor made equipment) or how should DM take this type of imbalance into consideration when planning adventures?

 

[Tabarnak Smokeblower]

No need for balancing. With that much damage potential, fights must be over in very few rounds. Ergo, the opponents don't have time to damage the opponents often.

TS

 

[MarauderX]

No need for balancing. With that much damage potential, fights must be over in very few rounds. Ergo, the opponents don't have time to damage the opponents often.

TS

...or so you hope...

I would go for the AC increases any way that you can. An AC=15 will get hit almost every round at your level, so even mage armor will help you out a lot if you can find an arcane caster to start hanging out with you. See if you can cash in any extra magic items to get some enhanced armor of some kind, and pay off a wizard to spend some time making some for you. It is FR after all - magic is pretty hard to remove completely.

 

[MadScientist]

I would go for the AC increases any way that you can. An AC=15 will get hit almost every round at your level, so even mage armor will help you out a lot if you can find an arcane caster to start hanging out with you.

Except mage armor's AC bonus will not stack with the AC bonus from the dwarf's chainmail (or any other armor). I agree that boosting AC would be good for these characters. At their level getting enchanted armor should be pretty easy. Rings of protection and amulets of natural armor should also be pretty attainable.

 

[Shadeus]

- fight defensively...with 5 ranks of tumble that's +3 to AC
- use the "aid another" combat manuever
- get Combat Expertise as a feat
- get Dodge as a feat

With a maxed out expertise and fighting defensively, that's -9 to attacks and +7 to AC. That's a bit extreme, but could do the trick in a pinch. The druid has barkskin that lasts for 80 minutes. I think its +3 to your AC at that level.

You don't have any arcane spellcaster in that mix, or even a rogue with a decent Use Magic Devise to get shield spells. Or even a cleric to get shield of faith. And you don't have anyone able to cast Magic Vestment. If potions are readily available, you might want to try to acquire some of these.

 

[frankthedm]

Did you guys level really fast on low treasure critters?

here is my normal answer;
Just like a party without healers the DM should provide the normal challenges for a party of that level. Eventually death will happen and either the raised PCs will noew focus more on defence or the newer pc's will be more defence orientated.....

to your DM for this situation since it looks like it is his fault

So the players have had no chances to trade in some of those weapons for defencive items? I just HAVE to make sure this ain't a case of players wanting their pie and eating it too. Let them trade / barter / sell some of thier very pricey weapons for defencive items. These guys are dead meat without tailored encounters. Just don't GIVE away magic defence without auditing some of that magic offence! BTW heavy dwarf armor makes for belivable treasure. if they won't give up any toys, waste 'em

Can you guys even get mundane equip? full plate is vital to low magic groups.



Dwarf Fgt 9
Heavy Mace +2, two handed, dmg 1d8+11 (Wep. Spec.)
AC 17 (Masterwork Breastplate)
HP: 94

needs full plate [8 +1 better than 5 + 2] and a shield since a heavy mace is normally a one hand weapon.


Elf Rng 8/Rog 1
Longsword +1 (vampiric), dmg 1d8+5(+1d6) (primary)
Shortsword +2, speed, dmg 1d6+4(+1d6) (off-hand)
AC 18 (Masterwork Leather)
HP: 89

weapons too good, way too much net worth of the ENTIRE party in those weapons. That XP penalty gotta suck. start using a shield more often.


Elf Drd 8/Rng 1/Prc 1
Longsword +1 (flaming), dmg 1d8+3+1d6 (primary)
Shorsword +1, dmg 1d6+2 (off-hand)
AC 17 (Wooden Chain Shirt) / 19 (Shield +1)
HP: 67

You stink of Milleke [sp] Death is too good for you. i will let you live. shield bash more often to TWF so you have a shield on the rounds you are not attacking. spiked sheild, if you areallowed to use it for this chara may be a good investment. Bark skin spell is your friend


Dwarf Brb2/Fgt5
Battleaxe +2 (flaming), dmg 1d12+11+1d6 / 1d12+14+1d6 (raging)
AC 15 (Chain mail)
HP: 76

You don't have the dex to be in chain mail. you don't have the dex to be a barbarian. get in full plate now find a new weapon and use a shield. You can still rage in heavy armor.

 

[Endur]

Barkskin
Druid Level 8 = +3 to AC for ten minutes per level
Druid level 9 = +4 to AC

 

[jmucchiello]

With a maxed out expertise and fighting defensively, that's -9 to attacks and +7 to AC.

Combat Expertise and fighting defensively do not stack. Also, you can only use Combat Reflexes when you make an attack or full attack action.

Benefit: When you use the attack action or the full attack action in melee, you can take a penalty of as much as –5 on your attack roll and add the same number (+5 or less) as a dodge bonus to your Armor Class. This number may not exceed your base attack bonus. The changes to attack rolls and Armor Class last until your next action.
Normal: A character without the Combat Expertise feat can fight defensively while using the attack or full attack action to take a –4 penalty on attack rolls and gain a +2 dodge bonus to Armor Class.

 

[Technik4]

The elven druid could take Craft Magic Arms and Armor.

The elven ranger could sell his shortsword of speed and buy some magicked leather.

The dwarf fighter could invest in some full-plate, or any type of heavy armor he can afford/acces. Also, could stop wielding 2-handed, and get a shield.

The dwarf barbarian/ftr should always be careful. He is 2 levels behind the highest level character, and all of his wealth is geared for offense (as well as his class levels). He would be better off going straight barbarian, especially in 3.5. At least try for breastplate.

Any of the characters could take Leadership, and pick up an arcane spellcaster. Good for enhancing items, tossing the occasional fireball, and eventually helping the party divine and teleport.

As a small commentary, your group has a couple gaping holes. Both elves should be suffering Exp penalties, apparantly, for poorly thought out min/maxed characters. Also, there appears to be no ranged attacks at all, and you are lacking an arcane spellcaster. That alone means CRs need to be skewed quite a bit, because your only option in a fight is to run at it and get in as many full-attacks as possible.

Consider a dragon balanced for the party's CR (8 or so). The dragon could abuse terrain and environment to deal damage at range and the party's only real option is to flee.

I think your group would do OK in narrow dungeons where fighting really is all melee, but out in the open you guys are severely hampered. The DM should try and keep you guys in enclosed environs for the majority of the time (as much to help the party as to suspend its disbelief) with the party helping in this direction. Additionally, the DM should look over critters and try to go for brutes. Cater a little to your rangers favored enemies, especially if the fight is going to be above CR 8.


Best of Luck!

Technik

 

[Darkness]

jmucchiello said
Combat Expertise and fighting defensively do not stack.

Not quite correct, mate:

3.5 PHB, page 140:
Fighting Defensively As A Standard Action: [description snipped] ... This bonus stacks with the AC bonus granted by the Combat Expertise feat (page 92).