Help me, fellow gamers! You're my only hope!

[Keeper of Secrets]

Mouseferatu, you and I would have to have a conversation back behind the woodshed if you pulled that in the group I was in.

Seriously, though I think I'll echo a little bit of what has already been said. I think you have become too comfortable with the system and it is showing. It seems like you are seeing less of 'a horrible demonic creature spewing fire, reeking of brimstone and eyes as black fury' and more of 'let's see, DR 10, immune to cold and fire, Gate three times per day . . .'

Honestly, that would totally ruin an experience for me, reducing everything to numbers. It would be to the point where I may as well just play a computer game instead.

I guess the best approach to try and combat this is to try to stay completely in character and try to convince the others to encourage you.

 

[Jhaelen]

I agree with Mark's advice wholeheartedly. As a longtime GM and part-time freelancer, the most fun I have playing today is definitely when I have no first-hand experience with the system. I've had great fun with The Undiscovered, The Chronicles of Ramlar, Fifth Cycle, etc -- small-press stuff that is, for me, completely new when I sit down at the table. Each such campaign is like roleplaying for the first time all over again

Ditto. I really think the D20 system is to be blamed for this to a certain degree. After about three years of playing it definitely has changed the way I think about roleplaying games.
So, it's really refreshing to start in a new group with a new system (or revisiting an old system you haven't played for a couple of years). Pick one that is heavy on roleplaying and light on rules and you'll soon get into the right mood again.

 

[Herobizkit]

It's a role-playing GAME. There is role-playing involved, but for the most part, D&D has always been about "killing things and taking their stuff". And if you've been playing mostly pre-gen adventures and monsters, your playstyle is going to adapt into the typical "us vs. them" mentality, where "us" is the players and "them" is the DM and the challenges in the game. It's a game that you don't want to lose, so it's only natural to want to scramble for any kind of advantage, even if that means metagaming.

That said, here's a few options:
1) Stop playing pre-gen adventures for a while. Have your DM cook up something completely off the cuff, or have him design an adventure where fighting isn't even an option. This may offend the warriors in your game, but hey, it's not like they haven't bathed in gallons of blood up to this point.

2) Start a new campaign with diplomacy, romance, and intrigue as the central focus. The "romantic fantasy" concepts introduced in Blue Rose are precisely what you may need.

3) Run a rules-lite d20 (again, like Blue Rose) where combat and tactics aren't necessarily the way to win every combat. Using "mook rules", most normal enemies will go splat in one hit, and you can reserve the highly unusual monsters and abilities for when they matter.

4) Switch up Monster Manuals. Get your DM to invest in a manual that's third-party, or use a different Manual other than Core. Monsters in there will be slightly less predicatable, and whether said monster will have fast-healing or regeneration or some other craziness... well, you really won't know, and neither will your character.

5) No one is perfect. It is a rare individual who can maintain character through an entire gaming session without mentally or orally braking character. Unless you're a trained actor, and a very good one at that, you shouldn't be expected to act like one ALL the time.

 

[Aylowan]

Go to a novelty store. Buy one of those toy zappers -- e.g., looks like an ink pen, but when you click it, it delivers an electric shock. Every time you start to think (or say) badwrongthings, click the pen.

Ta-da! Soon, even the thought of CRs, ELs, or other statistics will induce twitching and tremors.

I was going to suggest fining yourself $1 every time and adding it to the snack-buying pool for your group, but this might work, too.

 

[the Lorax]

Changing things up is the way I like to do it. Try one of these

-Spend some game days playing board or card games instead - ones that let you, or force you to make numbers based decisions. A game like Starfleet Battles really changes the mind set. After a few games of that, you'll want that old Role-Playing itch scratched.

-Learn a new RPG. Especially one that is distant from d20 mechanically. Like say Amber Diceless Role-Playing Game. Something where even to be moderately effective, you'll HAVE to pay attention to the actions and descriptions of the GM and other players.

-Switch from being a Player to being a DM. And to really ramp it up, find one of those "that guy"s to have as one of your players.

-Take a break, go on vacation (and not to Gen Con). Spend a week or a month away from it.

 

[Tinker Gnome]

I second the electric pen option!

 

[Bloosquig]

...And that is to completely relinquish the numbers of the game. Don't keep track of them. Don't have a character sheet in front of you at all. Of course you'll have to clear this with your DM, and make sure he's cool with keeping track of your character's numbers, but I speak from experience- this is EXACTLY what you need...

I agree wholeheartedly with this idea. Have your DM throw in some changes to the basic monsters and without any clear clue as to your own numbers everything else should fade a bit too. Just make an effort not to figure out your own numbers.

Nothing kicks a metagamer in the teeth like a surprise. I remember a time where our mid level party charged a bunch of ordinary looking orcs expecting an easy fight only to be forced to run or face a TPK because they all were half orc / troll hybrids with half a dozen fighter levels. Giving up some knowledge of your own abilities mixed with some creative dm'ing will help you just enjoy the game instead of worrying about whats going on with your characters numbers compared to the rest of the world without making you learn a totally new system that you'll just memorize shortly anyway.

Whatever you do good luck to ya!

 

[Mark]

I don't agree that you need a new system to play with to break you of this habit. That won't help when you're playing D&D, and I'm not convinced it will help regardless.

You can trust that it helps me.

Almost every Chicago gameday I try to play, as a player, a new system and have a blast being on unfamiliar ground, needing to rely on the character and not knowing how the numbers crunch. Invariably I spend more time in character or describing some action or what I am trying to do with little reliance on system jargon and more of a focus on how it appears in my mind's eye as an actual person would make such an attempt. It is a lot of fun.

I think most people that have played in games I run know that I enjoy the NPC/PC interaction every bit as much as the combat and such. If a group wants to fight their way through everything, I will roll with it, but there are almost always other options. Last gameday I ran a game for 7th-level NPC class characters that need to uncover a murder mystery during a local faire. I do not recall a weapon being drawn by a player character the whole game but everyone stayed on top of things and worked through the clues to success. From the DM side of things, I have found running a game like this a good way to stave off the meta-gameyness concerns.

Both good methods for me, so I hope they might be helpful to others.

 

[Oryan77]

I like to think that I'm the ideal player

I'm not perfect of course. I would say my only flaw is taking charge of a situation and slightly hogging the spotlight. But I'm just used to playing with players who never take charge and just look to me to make a decision, so that's why I do that. I never argue with a DM or fight with players, and I never metagame. I actually try to help the DM or players out if I can and if I think I'm stepping on someones toes about it, I'll quickly stop.

I DM 95% of the time though and I'm aware of the player type that you are describing. Even though I DM so much, I still seem to stay in character as a player and not metagame.

I'm not exactly sure how I do it, but I'd guess that it's because I occupy my mind by imagining the scenario in my head and think about what our characters would do rather than bother with what I think the DM is doing. During the whole game I am imagining everything in my head as if I'm reading a book. I also only focus on what I am doing rather than what everyone else is doing.

It's more fun for me to imagine an NPC interacting with me than thinking about how the DM is running the game.

Part of the fun of D&D for me is simply trying to get myself out of whatever situation presents itself. I don't care what other people do because I'm confident enough that I'll be smart enough to survive. Even if I somehow lose all of my characters equipment, I may be annoyed, but part of the thrill for me is figuring out how to survive afterwards and get back on my feet. So I guess I'm too busy thinking about how to keep my PC safe in a dangerous situation than focusing on metagaming piddly things that might do me more harm than good (if I'm wrong).

I always tell my players that if they try to out think me as a DM rather than out think the NPCs, it will one day bite them in the butt. Never assume you know the situation better than the DM. You never know what a DM is actually doing, and trying to metagame and whine about what the DM is doing will only ruin the fun that the DM is trying to provide. The only time I'd whine is after my PC is dead and I realize the DM screwed up!

 

[Particle_Man]

Nothing kicks a metagamer in the teeth like a surprise.

That was the main reason I have deliberately avoided wotc's monster books after the first one. I bought Iron Heroes' Bestiary to see how the new rules worked, and that is about it, monster-wise (a few creep in to other books, like Complete ARcane and XPH).

Thus if the DM pulls out Fiend Folio or MMIII or Book of Vile Darkness, I haven't a clue as to what is going to happen.