Help! Someone's going to play a Frenzied Berserker!

[Nightfall]

Yes I can see why that might be better than him dying and taking everyone with him...

 

[sam500]

I just realized I might be the player in question.
I think you guys are entirely too negative about the FB.
There are so many low cost ways to overcome the attack the nearest person thing.
First of all, frenzies don't last longer than many combats.
Second of all, with low will saves (ie: +1) pretty much any mental compunction spell will work on him.
Third, dominate person lasts days guys.
Fourth, nothing says an FB has to power attack his friends even if he is attacking.
Fifth, get a damn merciful weapon. Subdual damage is everyones friend right?
Sixth, my wife plays a bard. Music sooths or at least fascinates the savage beast.
Yours,
Sammy
ps: I really like the merciful weapons idea.

 

[lukelightning]

Frenzies do last longer than many combats.

I firmly believe that playing a character that is such a threat to your own companions is a bad idea. If you want a crazy-nutjob berzerker that gets out of control, play a barbarian and just roleplay your crazy frenzy. Let your fellow party members roleplay out their "talking you down."

I'd say a frenzied berzerker is fully responsible for all acts he commits while under a frenzy. So attacking your friends is a quick trip to evil land. It's like throwing a grenade and callously hitting your friends.

The FB is one of those classes that I believe needs unanimous player consent to include. If my fellow player brought one in over my objections, my character would not hesitate to use lethal force to stop him. Not just hold monster bit hold monster and coup de grace, or phantasmal killer.

You shouldn't have to retool your character and your character's resources to have to survive your fellow PCs character. If you have to devote your resources to preventing a fellow party member from killing you, you should probably be playing Paranoia and not standard D&D.

 

[IcyCool]

There are so many low cost ways to overcome the attack the nearest person thing.

Are you buying these "low-cost" solutions, or are you expecting the party to do it?

First of all, frenzies don't last longer than many combats.

An average combat lastsabout 5 rounds. How long does your frenzy last?

Second of all, with low will saves (ie: +1) pretty much any mental compunction spell will work on him.

This is a bad thing. You become a tool of the BBEG.

Third, dominate person lasts days guys.

So you have no problem being turned into a mindless puppet by your party?

Fourth, nothing says an FB has to power attack his friends even if he is attacking.

True.

Fifth, get a damn merciful weapon. Subdual damage is everyones friend right?

They are an additional expense, and they don't work on constructs or undead.

Sixth, my wife plays a bard. Music sooths or at least fascinates the savage beast.

True.

ps: I really like the merciful weapons idea.

Are you going to buy the merciful weapons?

 

[lukelightning]

Again, I think FB are just a way for players to sneak PvP into their game without being held responsible for their actions. "Sorry, I didn't want to kill your wizard, it was my character and he couldn't control himself..." (thinking: Sucker! I totally pwned your wizard!).

If you allow one player the freedom to attack other PCs, then you really shouldn't have a problem with my character sudden empowered enervation-ing and phantasmal killer-ing your character while under the effect of greater invisibility.

 

[sam500]

Are you buying these "low-cost" solutions, or are you expecting the party to do it?



An average combat lastsabout 5 rounds. How long does your frenzy last?



This is a bad thing. You become a tool of the BBEG.



So you have no problem being turned into a mindless puppet by your party?



True.



They are an additional expense, and they don't work on constructs or undead.



True.



Are you going to buy the merciful weapons?

low cost solutions meaning 1st or 2nd level spells. A simple command spell from a cleric telling the barbarian to flee will usually take up enough time to end the frenzy.

My frenzy lasts 5 rounds, how bout that.

All tanks have low will saves, and party members SHOULD cast pro evil or magic circle vs. evil on them regaurdless whether they're a barbarian, fighter, or FB.

Dominate person doesn't have to make you a mindless puppet. It can be used sparingly. A single command "don't attack party members" every 9 days would do. I don't consider 1 5th level spell every week and a half a big drain on party resources considering the benefits on damage output the FB gives the party.

Merciful weapons do work on constructs and undead, read the description, you can turn it off with a command.

Yes, I did buy the weapon. At 7th level and up, it shouldn't be a huge problem.


Honestly, most people on this board seem to be way too stiff. There are so many ways most problems can be overcome in D&D and a FB is no exception. Who cares if someone wants to play a FB. Let him, he'll die soon enough. All this threatening to kill the PC or kick him out the group is ridicuolous.

 

[Particle_Man]

I just realized I might be the player in question.

not if your location on your profile is accurate.

 

[Hypersmurf]

My frenzy lasts 5 rounds, how bout that.

You don't stack your Frenzy with Rage? Or your base Con score is 10?

All tanks have low will saves, and party members SHOULD cast pro evil or magic circle vs. evil on them regaurdless whether they're a barbarian, fighter, or FB.

Dominate person doesn't have to make you a mindless puppet. It can be used sparingly. A single command "don't attack party members" every 9 days would do. I don't consider 1 5th level spell every week and a half a big drain on party resources considering the benefits on damage output the FB gives the party.

"Ow! Ow! I thought we cast Dominate Person - ow! - and told you not to attack - ow! - us!"
"Yeah, but then you cast Protection from Evil on me. Sucker."

But I'm not convinced Dominate Person can be used 'sparingly'.

Once you have given a dominated creature a command, it continues to attempt to carry out that command to the exclusion of all other activities except those necessary for day-to-day survival (such as sleeping, eating, and so forth).

The Frenzied Berserker would devote all his attention to not attacking party members, to the exclusion of all other activities - like adventuring - except those necessary for day-to-day survival (such as sleeping, eating, and so forth).

-Hyp.

 

[IcyCool]

low cost solutions meaning 1st or 2nd level spells. A simple command spell from a cleric telling the barbarian to flee will usually take up enough time to end the frenzy.

Provided the FB fails the low DC will save. Some of the time it will work, and some of the time he'll kill a party member.

All tanks have low will saves, and party members SHOULD cast pro evil or magic circle vs. evil on them regaurdless whether they're a barbarian, fighter, or FB.

Protection from evil will invalidate your Dominate Person suggestion, FYI.

Merciful weapons do work on constructs and undead, read the description, you can turn it off with a command.

As my meaning didn't come across clearly, I'll restate. The merciful enchantment doesn't work on constructs or undead. With it turned off, you've got a +1 sword that you payed way too much for.

Yes, I did buy the weapon. At 7th level and up, it shouldn't be a huge problem.

Only one? What are the rest of the party supposed to do?

I'll point out that I don't think the FB is completely unplayable. I think it is a rude choice unless you work with the other players to try to minimize the harm you'll inflict on the party. Also, as the FB player, you'll need to be understanding when your PC dies because it came down to a situation of you vs. them.

 

[lukelightning]

All this threatening to kill the PC or kick him out the group is ridicuolous.

If you are allowed to make a character that is a clear and present danger to his companions, they have every right to be just as dangerous back. A simple command or other spell is not the answer; you could easily make your save, the cleric may not be in a position to cast the spell, etc.

Merciful weapons? Even if it is "only" non-lethal damage, you are weakening your compatriots. People act as if non-lethal damage is nothing, but being knocked unconscious in the middle of a fight can often be a death sentance.

Why is it so important for the FB player to have an ability that is both questionably designed and has such a high potential for friction?