Help! Someone's going to play a Frenzied Berserker!

Ok, people have got to stop reacting like the sky is falling every time someone mentions the words "Frenzied Berserker". The class is not that bad. I have played FBs, I have run FBs, I have played against FBs. You just have to fight them unconventionally.

Movement impediments: slow, web, grease, tanglefoot bags, sleet storm, caltrops, solid fog etc. FBs generally don't do ranged attacks (other than thrown objects). Do not let him get to melee with you.

Disabling attacks: Particularly ones with will saves are paramount. Stuns, sleeps, holds etc. They don't have a good Will save as a rule. Grappling, sundering and disarming attacks also work well. Beware attacks that rely on strength though. Effects that cause Fatigue or Exhaustion are also good.

Involuntary Activation: Frenzy can be triggered involuntarily. Enemies who are aware of the FB will try to snipe him and trigger a frenzy. FBs do not have many of these available per day. Triggering one early can be disastrous for the FB and his own party.

Non-hp-based damage: Attribute damage and drain attacks of all types. Psions do this easily. Mages of all types can use Ray of Enfeeblement or Enervation or similar spells. Non-mages can use wounding weapons and poisons (yes Fortitude is his good save but you can keep trying the poison anyway).

All of this panic about FBs is absolute nonsense. Players and DMs just need to think outside the box for once. Straight damage is the one thing you cannot use to fight a FB and too often that is all PCs and DMs ever think about.

Tzarevitch
 

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Tzarevitch said:
All of this panic about FBs is absolute nonsense. Players and DMs just need to think outside the box for once. Straight damage is the one thing you cannot use to fight a FB and too often that is all PCs and DMs ever think about.
The issue boils down to the fact that if you're a spellcaster you can try to harass an FB into submission and get swiftly killed by them (guess who just got bumped up to the top of the 'Enemy' line? :p ) or, if you're not all magical and whatnot, you can sit on your thumbs and get hacked appart.

Damage is one of the cornerstones of combat. Arguably the single most important part. FBs are immune to it. The class was not well designed in that regard.
 

Tzarevitch said:
All of this panic about FBs is absolute nonsense. Players and DMs just need to think outside the box for once.

It's not nonsense to not want to play with people playing characters that will attack the party.

You just have to fight them unconventionally.

That's part of the problem; enemies should be challenging, even if they just run into the party in the hall. Characters that require every enemy to know about their Achilles Heel for a challenging fight are problems.
 

Sejs said:
The issue boils down to the fact that if you're a spellcaster you can try to harass an FB into submission and get swiftly killed by them (guess who just got bumped up to the top of the 'Enemy' line? :p ) or, if you're not all magical and whatnot, you can sit on your thumbs and get hacked appart.

Damage is one of the cornerstones of combat. Arguably the single most important part. FBs are immune to it. The class was not well designed in that regard.
Once you get into high levels, damage isn't important. Saves are.
 

Stalker0 said:
They may not think that way when the FB kills one of them before he's put down. Its really not a question of if, its a question of when...
I don't know about that. Given a 1 in 20 chance of blowing that Will save, plus the availability of calm emotions, high-AC characters using total defense, etc., I imagine that one could in fact play an FB without it *ever* happening.
 

prosfilaes said:
It always gets me what people find implausible in D&D. Humans in D&D can absorb the damage it takes someone to get to -20 HP; all that takes is 21 points of damage. There are some humans running around that can absorb enough damage to get someone to -200 HP, however absurd that may be.

I think the type of damage done makes a big difference. Getting knocked to -200 HP by a group of longbow-wielding archers (20-30 arrows or so) would leave a good portion of your body intact. Getting knocked to -200 HP by a couple of red dragons breathing on you would probably leave nothing behind but a pile of ash.
 





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