D&D 5E Hex Shenanigans

[Helldritch]

All this for a spell that should've been a class feature...

I know that some players are doing this to keep more spell slot during the day. Their goal is to cast their last spell on a chicken/rat before recovering their spell slots. But when do they recover their spell slots?

In the morning, it when they wake up. So casting hex then, just cost them the slot they wanted to "save". If they cast it before going to sleep, they no longer concentrate on the spell and it is lost. So when they wake up... you see where this goes.

Then it must be for those short rests. I would perfectly allow it. Cast it before a short rest. Rest. Recover your spell slots and voilà! Or just do like me. Once a creature died, you can keep the spell as long as you concentrate on it, whether you can target or creature or not. The initial requirement for casting the spell has been met already. Nothing says that the spell can't be maintained (concentrated upon) without a valid target. As soon as a valid target is in sight, then BOOM! You put Hex on the unfortunate soul. Repeat ad nauseam. No need for chickens or poor rats, or puppies or whatever hurts your feeling.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

Do any class abilities have a caveat: Caution! Does not work if your DM suspects you my using the game rules to do things the game allows but the DM doesn't like?

Yes.

All rules come with a "caveat." Or, as I put it, it's a game, with a referee.

And the game has a very basic rule, which is that the referee both has the final interpretation of all rules, and also can modify, add, or discard rules as necessary in order to make the game better for the participants.

This is stated succinctly in the 5e DMG as such:
"And as a referee, the DM interprets the rules and decides when to abide by them and when to change them." "The D&D rules help you and the other players have a good time, but the rules aren't in charge. You're the DM, and you are in charge of the game."

In fact, one of the three sections in the DMG is devoted solely to changing the rules. So in a certain sense, every rule has the caveat that it can be changed. That's the nature of D&D.

 

[billd91]

All rules come with a "caveat." Or, as I put it, it's a game, with a referee.

Yes, technically, but of course there's a bit of caveat emptor even when using such referee powers. Mess with too many PC abilities or rules and you'll probably just frustrate your players for no appreciable gain. And honestly, I do not think houseruling so that a character can't benefit from a short rest while concentrating on a spell just to prevent a warlock from regaining the spell slot used to cast hex is worth the price.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

Yes, technically, but of course there's a bit of caveat emptor even when using such referee powers. Mess with too many PC abilities or rules and you'll probably just frustrate your players for no appreciable gain. And honestly, I do not think houseruling so that a character can't benefit from a short rest while concentrating on a spell just to prevent a warlock from regaining the spell slot used to cast hex is worth the price.

Maybe.

But look at what I replied to.

In the end, you can caterwaul about the unreasonable DM who won't let you use you a bag of rats, or you can snipe at the childish player stamping his feet and turning red in the face while screaming "the rules!" but it doesn't really matter.

You either agree, or you don't. The sun will rise, the sun will set, and either you are playing with people you get along with, or you aren't.

But insisting that the DM has to do something because of your interpretation of the rules is a fast way to end a game and lose a DM, and has the disadvantage of also being "technically" incorrect.

 

[jasper]

......

The 'bag of rats' problem is not a problem of player behaviour, it is a problem of poorly written rules. If you don't like the way hex or any other spell works, then change the spell description. It will then work according to that revised description.

.....

As a DM my job is to fix poorly written rules. If you suggest the bag of rats solution, I would say nay. Now back then when I was a problem dm, I would just use your tactic against you. AKA what is good tactics for the pc are excellence tactics for the monsters. Now days, I would say you are trying to be cheesy and not allow it.

 

[MGibster]

My first 5E campaign was very much tongue-in-cheek. Classes and levels were all part of the world. I had one NPC who I modeled off of Princess Peach who went to Barbarian school. I would have absolutely allowed such rules exploits in that game because my who conceit is that they were actually in someone's game world.

 

[Flamestrike]

I simply ruled that as long as you concentrate on it you only have to use a bonus action to put it on a new target. The spell only needs a target for the initial victim. After that, the spell is in a ready state. Of course if you lose concentration...

Thats the rule RAW.

If you're concentrating on Hex, and combat ends, you just need to wait till your next turn (in the next encounter) to shift it.

Your next turn could be 30 minutes after the last encounter ended.

No need for chickens.

Incidentally a player that tried this at my table would get a look that conveys 'try this or anything like this again, and I'll come down on you like a ton of bricks'. Then I would explain the rule.

 

[Oofta]

...
Incidentally a player that tried this at my table would get a look that conveys 'try this or anything like this again, and I'll come down on you like a ton of bricks'. Then I would explain the rule.

But the real question is ... can you drop the bricks on the chickens?

 

[doctorbadwolf]

2) the other players may take issue with the warlock performing a ritual (taking a short rest to get the spell slot back) to kill an innocent animal in a rite to enhance his killing power. Most characters I've played would seriously object to such activity.

Why? Sacrificng animals is literally just a normal part of religion for most of history. You usually eat the thing afterward, of course.

Someone else mentioned the idea of one's patron getting mad, and...lol what? Why would the patron care? And so what if they do? Warlocks aren't clerics. They don't have to get along with their patron, or care about what they want.

 

[Helldritch]

Thats the rule RAW.

If you're concentrating on Hex, and combat ends, you just need to wait till your next turn (in the next encounter) to shift it.

Your next turn could be 30 minutes after the last encounter ended.

No need for chickens.

Incidentally a player that tried this at my table would get a look that conveys 'try this or anything like this again, and I'll come down on you like a ton of bricks'. Then I would explain the rule.

Exactly. I never said it was otherwise. For some reasons, some people feel that the spell ends if no other "valid" targets are there... It is a common misconception often seen but I always thought that the wording on this spell was quite correct.