D&D 5E Hex Shenanigans

[Arial Black]

I would say the guy that gets upset that the DM makes a ruling that they disagree with is the problem.

There are no "laws of the universe" to change. There are rules in the book. There's a DM. The DM decides how the rules from the book are implemented.

I've had DMs make rulings I disagree with. I quit a game because I got fed up with it and the DM wouldn't change after I calmly explained what my issue was and why. But claiming they're changing the nonexistent laws of the universe? Nah.

Non laws of the universe? So gravity, light, mass, everything, is entirely random? No human could have evolved or survive such an environment.

 

[jaelis]

As I said, more than once, I have and would hex the creature we just caught and are about to cook and eat.

OK but this is a bit of a dodge. What exactly is this creature you are hunting? 99% of the time when I play, we have rations. When we don't, the travel rules have you foraging through the day as you travel, not specifically in the morning to catch something before breakfast. And is it you doing the hunting? That's maybe not the most typical warlock thing, but ok, no reason you can't. Are you actually playing this out, where you try to spot a creature (probably not a chicken) and hex it before you try to blast it? If you're doing all that, then my guess is that no one's going to quibble about the hex, because they'll all be too annoyed about wasting game time on food.

If its just a hand wave... 'oh I hunt down breakfast and hex it...' well I think that's a bit cheesy, and since what you're doing is outside the rules anyway, can you really complain so much if I say no?

 

[Oofta]

Non laws of the universe? So gravity, light, mass, everything, is entirely random? No human could have evolved or survive such an environment.

Making a ruling you disagree with doesn't make it random.

But I will say that no human has ever evolved in my campaign universe. It's not real.

On the other hand it is up to me as the DM to implement the rules we use to interact with this completely imaginary world to build a story.

 

[Arial Black]

"At our table, CR0 creatures with a max hp of 1 do not count as 'creatures' when targeting spells and other offensive abilities."

At least it is a serious attempt at a coherent definition, in pleasant contrast to "however I feel at the time".

Shame about alarm being less effective under that ruling.

Also, how is it that these 1hp creatures do not 'count' as creatures when targeting spells and other offensive abilities, but do count for other purposes?

Are you really making this ruling because you truly believe that they are or are not creatures depending on the alleged intentions of nearby casters? Because it comes across as an attempt to redefine the word just so I can't hex chickens.

 

[jaelis]

Shame about alarm being less effective under that ruling.

Alarm isn't impacted one way or the other because its not targeting the bug. Though myself, I'd rather not have alarm going off every time a bug wandered by.

Also, how is it that these 1hp creatures do not 'count' as creatures when targeting spells and other offensive abilities, but do count for other purposes?

Because I'm the DM and that's my table rule.

Are you really making this ruling because you truly believe that they are or are not creatures depending on the alleged intentions of nearby casters? Because it comes across as an attempt to redefine the word just so I can't hex chickens.

I don't see how the intention of the caster factors into this ruling at all. I care very little about hex, I'm much more concerned about sleep, grim harvest, and the like.

 

[Arial Black]

Well spiders do have 1 hp, they are in the monster manual. So if you've established that there are spiders in the area, you would indeed have them stymie the sleep spell? And I can carry a box of spiders around to protect myself?

Some spiders are big enough that they do have 1 or more hit points. Such creatures are 'tiny' in game terms, about the size of a cat. Carry a box of them just like you would (or wouldn't) carry a bag of rats or a cage of chickens.

There are many much smaller spiders that don't have game stats, because they are 'creatures' but are not 'monsters' as described in the MM, the section I quoted not long ago. But if a 'spider' IS one from the MM, or a rat or chicken, and you got attacked by some....why wouldn't sleep work? According to the MM, they are 'monsters'; creatures that you can interact with and potentially fight and kill, so why would offensive magic not work on them?

Not all creatures are 'monsters'. They don't all have game stats. But the ones in the MM are both 'creatures' and 'monsters' by the game's own definition, and interact with spells and other game elements as written.

So, the 20-foot radius circle of your sleep spell in the woods is likely to have hundreds of creepy-crawlies, including various species of arachnid, that are so small that they (while still being 'creatures') are not 'monsters' and have no game stats, including hit points. Any that are big enough to be a 'monster' interact with the game normally, including having their hit points subtract from the sleep pool. But there are unlikely to be hundreds of cat-sized spiders you didn't notice, and it'd be a jerk DM that made some spontaneously appear every time you cast sleep, or who defined the ones that are big enough to have stats and be defined as 'monsters' count as 'not creatures' while they are biting hit point-sized chunks out of you.

 

[Arial Black]

OK but this is a bit of a dodge. What exactly is this creature you are hunting? 99% of the time when I play, we have rations. When we don't, the travel rules have you foraging through the day as you travel, not specifically in the morning to catch something before breakfast. And is it you doing the hunting? That's maybe not the most typical warlock thing, but ok, no reason you can't. Are you actually playing this out, where you try to spot a creature (probably not a chicken) and hex it before you try to blast it? If you're doing all that, then my guess is that no one's going to quibble about the hex, because they'll all be too annoyed about wasting game time on food.

If its just a hand wave... 'oh I hunt down breakfast and hex it...' well I think that's a bit cheesy, and since what you're doing is outside the rules anyway, can you really complain so much if I say no?

What part is outside the rules?

We hunt in order to make our rations go further. Rabbits, mainly. Whether we catch one depends on the Survival skill check. We don't play it out in greater detail, any more than we roll initiative before shaving or define 'toilet order' like we do 'marching order'.

 

[jaelis]

Ah snap, you know what the right way to do this is, to suppose the warlock has a bag of tricks that he uses every morning. If he gets a weenie animal like a bat or rat, he sacrifices it to activate his hex.

That gets around the chicken-hauling nonsense or the hunting breakfast dodge, and it makes nice use of an offbeat magic item.

 

[jaelis]

Some spiders are big enough that they do have 1 or more hit points. Such creatures are 'tiny' in game terms, about the size of a cat. Carry a box of them just like you would (or wouldn't) carry a bag of rats or a cage of chickens.

Ah, so some spiders are creatures but some aren't? I'm fine with that. And I'll raise you some chickens are creatures and some aren't.

Also, to my knowledge there's no lower limit on the size of a tiny creature. Sea horses are listed as tiny, and they are much smaller than a cat.

 

[Arial Black]

Ah snap, you know what the right way to do this is, to suppose the warlock has a bag of tricks that he uses every morning. If he gets a weenie animal like a bat or rat, he sacrifices it to activate his hex.

That gets around the chicken-hauling nonsense or the hunting breakfast dodge, and it makes nice use of an offbeat magic item.

Do you think that if it wasn't for the existence of the hex spell that the party would stop hunting for food?

Our parties have been hunting breakfast since before AD&D needed to be referred to as 'first edition'.