High AC Barbarian

[Nifft]

That looks like a straight-up bonus to AC, rather than a bonus to compensate for a penalty.

If it was in addition, he'd gain +8 Str instead of +4. That's insane.

Cheers, -- N

 

[SlagMortar]

I believe Old Gumphrey was reading into this line:

RAGE VARIANT: WHIRLING FRENZY
A barbarian with this variant form of rage doesn't gain the normal bonuses when he enters a rage.

(emphasis mine)
Since it doesn't say "normal bonuses or penalties", one could read that to mean that any penalties from normal rage are carried over to whirling frenzy. If that was the intent, then it is very poorly written, but it certainly could be read that way. Either way there is no +8 bonus to strength.

 

[Nail]

If that was the intent, then it is very poorly written, but it certainly could be read that way.

True enough.

There's also this poorly worded line after what I quoted: "Whirling frenzy is otherwise identical to the standard barbarian rage in all other ways. "

Eeek. Now what's that supposed to mean? What were they thinking? :\

 

[Old Gumphrey]

True enough.

There's also this poorly worded line after what I quoted: "Whirling frenzy is otherwise identical to the standard barbarian rage in all other ways. "

Eeek. Now what's that supposed to mean? What were they thinking? :\

'Otherwise identical' means aside from the replaced bonuses just mentioned, it lasts Con mod rounds and you get the same number per day as a regular barbarian, can't use spells, Combat Expertise, while it's going on, etc. Basically to reinforce that it carries all the other restrictions and parameters of a normal barbarian rage.

 

[Nail]

'Otherwise identical' means aside from the replaced bonuses just mentioned, it lasts Con mod rounds and you get the same number per day as a regular barbarian, can't use spells, Combat Expertise, while it's going on, etc. Basically to reinforce that it carries all the other restrictions and parameters of a normal barbarian rage.

I agree that's what the intent probably was.

But as written, it means: "replace the normal bonuses, but keep the penalties, etc." Yuck. Bad UA Writer, bad! <smack with rolled up newspaper>

 

[The Souljourner]

Umm... I think it's funny that people are posting all kinds of ways to make a barbarian with higher ac without the most obvious - use a damn shield. Not every barbarian has to use a two handed weapon. I know it's iconic, but come on! A dwarven barbarian with a large steel shield and a dwarven war axe with that whirling frenzy? +6 AC over a normal raging barbarian. That's way better than +4 con, since the con goes away, and the attacks that miss you because of +6 AC don't.

I'm tempted to make this character just to show that not all barbarians have to be paper tigers. Heck, I'd be tempted to take a level of fighter for the free feat and tower shield proficiency and use a tower shield (use the feat for shield specialization and pick up another +1 AC). I'd love to see the DM ask me what my barbarian's AC is while "raging" and be able to reply "25" instead of "16".

-Nate

 

[Erywin]

Umm... I think it's funny that people are posting all kinds of ways to make a barbarian with higher ac without the most obvious - use a damn shield. Not every barbarian has to use a two handed weapon. I know it's iconic, but come on! A dwarven barbarian with a large steel shield and a dwarven war axe with that whirling frenzy? +6 AC over a normal raging barbarian. That's way better than +4 con, since the con goes away, and the attacks that miss you because of +6 AC don't.

I'm tempted to make this character just to show that not all barbarians have to be paper tigers. Heck, I'd be tempted to take a level of fighter for the free feat and tower shield proficiency and use a tower shield (use the feat for shield specialization and pick up another +1 AC). I'd love to see the DM ask me what my barbarian's AC is while "raging" and be able to reply "25" instead of "16".

-Nate

I would love to see this build, just so that I could throw it at my players. "You see a raging dwarf barbarian charging you with a tower shield and a dwarven axe. You hit an AC 24? sorry but you miss."

Cheers,
E

 

[The Souljourner]

I actually forgot that tower shields have a max dex bonus of +2, so he needs a mithral one to get full dex out of his armor. Richer people could have a lower dex and mithral heavy armor, but I'm trying to keep it low level. Let's assume he spends his gold on a mithral tower shield. It is his pride and joy, after all.

Dwarf Barbarian 1/Fighter 1

Dex 16 (+3)
Breastplate (+5)
Tower Shield (+4)
Alternate rage (whirling frenzy +2)
Shield Specialization (+1)
= AC 25

Feats:
Weapon focus: dwarven waraxe
Shield Specialization: Tower Shield

(32 point buy)
16 strength
16 dex
16 con
10 int
10 Wis
8 Cha

Attacks: Dwarven War Axe (+4, 1d10+3) (+6/+6 1d10+5 while in frenzy)
AC: 23 (25 in frenzy)
BAB: +2
HD: 1d10+1d12+6 (18hp)

2d10+10 is pretty lethal at 2nd level.

-Nate

 

[Erywin]

How well would that scale up to say about 8th or 10th level? Love the fact that barbarians don't always need to have a crap AC while raging. Currently in the campaign I DM, the PC barbarian is my most likely target while he is raging... Mainly due to the fact that even with the party's insistance and help with gear, he has refused to bring his AC up. Why would a bad guy hit the Crusader/Rogue with an insane AC when he can just PA the low AC barbarian.

Cheers,
E

PS. his attacks seem a little off, +2 BAB +3 Str +1 WF = +6 attack regular, +8 while raging or +6/+6 if he takes the additional attack.

 

[The Souljourner]

How well would that scale up to say about 8th or 10th level?

With higher levels comes money for magic items, and magic armor is pretty cheap. I'd continue with full barbarian levels... it gets him improved uncanny dodge (flanking) by 6th level which fits very nicely with his defensive theme.

Love the fact that barbarians don't always need to have a crap AC while raging.

Yeah, me too. In fact, it kinda makes me want the play the guy.

PS. his attacks seem a little off, +2 BAB +3 Str +1 WF = +6 attack regular, +8 while raging or +6/+6 if he takes the additional attack.

Tower shield has a drawback: -2 on all your attacks.

-Nate