D&D 4E Hints on Sandboxing with 4e?

[Neonchameleon]

Some preparation/planning is great, but the downside can be decision paralysis and overly-cautious play that drags everything out interminably. I also think that in 4e task resolution (combat or skill challenge) can take so long, it doesn't leave much time for prep/planning if you want to get a decent amount done. And 4e unlike 3e doesn't particularly reward prep - 3e was so hugely biased towards pre-buffing and first-strike that not prepping could be suicidal.

... One of these days I'm going to write out in detail what I use skill challenges for and how I use them. They do not, for me, slow the game down at all. What they do is provide a mechanic for handling a complex task that can't be managed off one roll, and that isn't graded entirely pass/fail (for instance hiding a dragon wyrmling in a cart and taking it across a city to a safehouse or breaking into a locked building from the first floor window) and that you can scramble to recover if it goes wrong.

 

[Rel]

... One of these days I'm going to write out in detail what I use skill challenges for and how I use them. They do not, for me, slow the game down at all. What they do is provide a mechanic for handling a complex task that can't be managed off one roll, and that isn't graded entirely pass/fail (for instance hiding a dragon wyrmling in a cart and taking it across a city to a safehouse or breaking into a locked building from the first floor window) and that you can scramble to recover if it goes wrong.

The understanding that Skill Challenges can be used for that purpose was a HUGE breakthrough for me as a DM. Whenever my group got to a point where they'd been planning for more than say 10 minutes, I'd pipe up and say, "Let's make this a Skill Challenge. Tell me your Goal."

Instead of an hour of minutia detailing seven or eight versions of exactly how they were going to scout the enemy camp, determine which tent the princess was in and distract the guards to achieve total surprise, we'd have 5 minutes of rolling some skill rolls and we're into the action.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

Some preparation/planning is great, but the downside can be decision paralysis and overly-cautious play that drags everything out interminably. I also think that in 4e task resolution (combat or skill challenge) can take so long, it doesn't leave much time for prep/planning if you want to get a decent amount done. And 4e unlike 3e doesn't particularly reward prep - 3e was so hugely biased towards pre-buffing and first-strike that not prepping could be suicidal.

Well, I suppose it can go overboard. OTOH if that is the aspect of the game that the players really enjoy then I don't really think it matters if it means they go through a few less encounters in a session. What I might do for a group like that is shade things in favor of making prep more interesting and challenging vs other things. Instead of an elaborate puzzle I might have a situation where the PCs preparations come into play or some encounters that really make those preparations valuable.

 

[Rel]

Well, I suppose it can go overboard. OTOH if that is the aspect of the game that the players really enjoy then I don't really think it matters if it means they go through a few less encounters in a session. What I might do for a group like that is shade things in favor of making prep more interesting and challenging vs other things. Instead of an elaborate puzzle I might have a situation where the PCs preparations come into play or some encounters that really make those preparations valuable.

Planning is a GOOD thing. The problem in gaming (in my experience) is OVER planning.

The players will huddle up and start coming up with their brilliant plan using available resources. Then they'll reach that first point where something might go wrong. Then they start planning contingencies. Then they'll plan contingencies for those contingencies. Then somebody will realize that they have a spell/ability/item that makes for a better initial plan. Then they start over.

I am embarrassed to say so, but I'm a Tactical type of player and I used to be one of the worst in my group about doing this. My (more narrative focused) GM took me to task for this and deservedly so. I have since mended my ways and learned that a good plan that we can come up with in 10 minutes is far better than a perfect plan that takes us two hours.

The reason that Skill Challenges help this is because once you're in that mode there is feedback. While in "planning mode" there is no feedback, only a lot of vague possible scenarios that are purely theoretical. Once the dice start rolling we know right away how successful the initial plan was and what the consequences were for failure. So the players can then quickly reallocate their skills and resources to actual events rather than plan for every possibility. This moves things along much more quickly while still allowing for creative solutions (for which I give bonuses or automatic successes based on the idea proposed).