D&D 5E (2024) How can I do a Charisma-Investigation (or a Strength/Dexterity-Investigation if I can't use Charisma) to find a secret door?

[Maxperson]

You're asking us to find a way to convince your DM to use CHA to find secret doors? Maybe just accept you have a party of dum-dums and roll with it?

Yep. This is what happens with the concept of a dump stat. All stats are important.

As for the OP, charisma is right out. No way I can see to do that. Same with dex. However, if the PCs got a sledgehammer and went around the rooms bashing the walls really hard every few feet, I'd allow them to roll strength investigation checks in-between all the wandering monster combats.

 

[Maxperson]

Everyone dumping Int to 8 is pretty standard in my experience if you don't have an Artificer or Wizard. It's just such a completely useless stat for everyone else

No stat is useless. Knowledge checks are one of the most common and important checks out there. And yes, I know they aren't called knowledge checks any longer, but the skills are the same and the information is the same.

 

[Plaguescarred]

The DMG offer some guidance on Perception vs Investigation;

PERCEPTION
Using the Investigation Skill. The Investigation skill applies to situations where a character is using reason and deduction to arrive at a conclusion about something under examination. Investigation applies when characters are trying to figure out how a thing works—how to open a trick door, how to get into a secret compartment, and so on.

Don't use the Investigation skill to determine if a character notices something—that's the purview of Perception. For example, a successful Wisdom (Perception) check allows a character to find a secret door or something that betrays its presence, such as thin seams marking the edges of the door. If the secret door is locked, a successful Intelligence (Investigation) check would allow a character to figure out the trick to opening it—by turning a nearby statue so it faces the door, for example.

 

[aco175]

Maybe the ranger can speak with rats to find them. The druid might poly into something with a good check like a dog.

 

[DEFCON 1]

There's also of course the "old school" method for solving all of this... which is that you don't make a skill check to find any secret door at all. Rather, players just say they are going to search certain areas... and if there is a "secret door" in the 10'x10' section they are searching, then the DM just gives verbal descriptive clues as to what the players are finding. Then the players describe their actions to continue to figure out what they are looking at, the DM gives even more details about it, until finally the players accurately state what the secret door is and what they are doing to try and open it. No need for skill checks at all.

I think a lot of us have been programmed over the years to have secret doors end up being like they are in video games like Baldur's Gate-- where there's nothing to actually find until a successful check is made, and then suddenly POOF! the purple outline shows up in a spot that says "This section is now a secret door!" But in truth, every secret door should have a description as to how and why they are hidden and secret, and a method for players to describe how to get around that hidden description.

"Why is that door a 'secret door'?"
"Because it is behind a tapestry hanging on the wall."
"So I can find it just by looking behind the tapestry?"
"Yep"
"And I don't need to make any skill check?"
"No. The door is right there. Once you get past the thing that made it "secret", it's no longer "secret". It's just a door."

 

[Stormonu]

The DM is under no obligation to help those who deliberately sabotage themselves. Some ability scores just aren't going to work for certain activities. Obviously, your group needs to reconsider dumping INT.

 

[Voadam]

Dex would be the most logical sounding to me of those three.

Running your fingers across possible seams, checking out whether sconces turn or books in a book case don't come out because they are actually mechanism levers, seeing if any bricks or stones move under pressure, that sort of thing.

Narratively check out if there is stuff like evidence of disturbed dust going to a wall, any misplaced books on a bookshelf that kind of thing which can be tipoffs without requiring a roll.

 

[mellored]

Do an IRL Charisma check and as the DM to reveal secret doors.

 

[mellored]

Do an IRL Charisma check and as the DM to tell you where the doors are.
If that fails, use IRL Strength/Dexterity to grab the map from behind thr DM screen.

Alternative, be a sorcerer or bard and cast Knock repeatedly.

 

[SpellObjectEnthusiast]

The 2014 DM's Guide gives reasonable guidance on handling secret doors, Page 103-104. Added some Bold/Italics to highlight important lines.

No int in your group? Break down the doors!

"Secret Doors

A secret door is crafted to blend into the wall that surrounds it. Sometimes faint cracks in the wall or scuff marks on the floor betray the secret door's presence.

Detecting a Secret Door. Use the characters' passive Wisdom (Perception) scores to determine whether anyone in the party notices a secret door without actively searching for it. Characters can also find a secret door by actively searching the location where the door is hidden and succeeding on a Wisdom (Perception) check. To set an appropriate DC for the check, see chapter 8.

Opening a Secret Door. Once a secret door is detected, a successful Intelligence (Investigation) check might be required to determine how to open it if the opening mechanism isn't obvious. Set the DC according to the difficulty guidelines in chapter 8.

If adventurers can't determine how to open a secret door, breaking it down is always an option. Treat it as a locked door made of the same material as the surrounding wall, and use the guidelines in chapter 8 to determine appropriate DCs or statistics."

Some doors don't even need an Investigation check to open, or even a perception check to find!

"Concealed Doors

A concealed door is a normal door that is hidden from view. A secret door is carefully crafted to blend into its surrounding surface, whereas a concealed door is most often hidden by mundane means. It might be covered by a tapestry, covered with plaster, or (in the case of a concealed trapdoor) hidden under a rug. Normally, no ability check is required to find a concealed door. A character need only look in the right place or take the right steps to reveal the door. However, you can use the characters' passive Wisdom (Perception) scores to determine whether any of them notices tracks or signs of a tapestry or rug having been recently disturbed."