How Come There Is No "Wish" Spell?

[Cbas_10]

As with any of the individual changes in 4e, I'm not passionate about liking or disliking a change. However, I do agree with the sentiment that it should be more of a plot device, divine/genie opportunity, etc. This change is cool by me!

 

[JRRNeiklot]

I'd actually like to see "Wish," such as it is, returned as a Geas of sorts on magical beings.

So a genie might be bound to grant you 3 wishes (within the realm of whatever spell-like abilities it possesses) but be free to, umm, interpret your request.

That's "Wish" the way it should be. Not some "do anything, but not really" power, but a geas placed on a magical creature that has to fulfill it, to the letter of your request. Wish becomes, essentially, a plot device.

That works for me.

I concur. This is the way we always used wish in 1st edition. Your wish was granted by your deity, or whichever deity had his attention cast your way should you lack a deity. A lawful good deity grants most wishes without screwing you over, so long as they are not selfish milliongold pieces and +12 Hackmaster wishes. A mischievious deity might screw with you a bit, but nothing truly devastating.
While on another plane, the ruler of that plane had the power to grant the wish, so if you were in the Abyss, Orcus might grant your wish, and as such might interpret in the worst possible light. In fact, I believe it was spelled out as such in the Bloodstone series, and getting a wish granted there shifted your alignment toward chaotic evil.

 

[JRRNeiklot]

Do you remember what some of the suggestions for acceptable wishes were? A player who was facing a werewolf and wished for a magic weapon to fight it with had a +1 sword appear in his hand, which would disappear after the fight was over. Wow. Now that's some power, there!

Isn't that exactly what he asked for? "I wish for a magic weapon to fight the werewolf."

I mean wishing for a mug of ale is not really powerful either, but it would be within the parameters of the spell.

 

[Hussar]

Meh, adding in some sort of wish ability to the genie could be as simple as allowing the genie to have a permanent sort of Major Creation spell. There, now you can wish for all sorts of things - material wealth, non-magic weapons of excellent quality so on
and so forth.

Isn't that exactly what he asked for? "I wish for a magic weapon to fight the werewolf."

I mean wishing for a mug of ale is not really powerful either, but it would be within the parameters of the spell.

And this is exactly where the fight starts between player and DM. The player knows the DM is going to screw him Monkey's Paw style, so he deliberately low balls.

Never mind the fact that if the PC has access to wish, why in Hell doesn't he have a +1 sword? FFS, SELL the wish!

 

[fuindordm]

Isn't that exactly what he asked for? "I wish for a magic weapon to fight the werewolf."

One thing I do like about the 3E version of wish is that it explicitly defaults to existing spells. If "impersonal" wishes (granted by devices or spells without requiring the intervention of a powerful being) exist, I think they should grant wishes in the simplest and "cheapest" way possible.

So when I hear of a DM doing something like this, I have a WTF moment. The wish finds a magic sword and teleports it to the player, then wastes energy teleporting it away?

"I wish I were stronger" from such a wish should default to a Bull's Strength spell, if the player doesn't already have an enhancement effect going. "I wish I had an effective weapon for this fight" might just end up casting Magic Weapon on their sword.

It's much more fun to have wishes granted by powerful beings.

 

[Stone Dog]

Gasp! The Tarrasque is invincible now! AAIEEEE!

 

[Anthtriel]

One thing I do like about the 3E version of wish is that it explicitly defaults to existing spells. If "impersonal" wishes (granted by devices or spells without requiring the intervention of a powerful being) exist, I think they should grant wishes in the simplest and "cheapest" way possible.

Unless the player wished for something worthwhile, then it works in the way that's best suited to completely screw over the character.

 

[Merlin the Tuna]

Gasp! The Tarrasque is invincible now! AAIEEEE!

Either that or he'll be difficult to beat rather than difficult to kill.

 

[Plane Sailing]

IMO this is a good change. A "wish" spell that PCs could regularly cast didn't belong in the game.

What do you call 'regularly' though? Unless you allow casters to lose a level by spending more xp than they have at a particular level (I can't remember the rules about that, but even if you could the wizard would be pretty insane), then a 17th level wizard will be able to cast between 0 and 3 wishes before losing the ability to cast wishes!

5000xp is a huge investment for a 17th+ level character, it is more than 1/4 of the way to your next level.

I can't imagine any scenario where that is 'regularly cast'

 

[WhatGravitas]

5000xp is a huge investment for a 17th+ level character, it is more than 1/4 of the way to your next level.

Eh, it's like item creation. Do it before your next level rise, then reap extra XP for being lower level. IIRC, the XP difference between levels on the higher end is quite extreme, so it's not hurting that much, it's more of a psychological barrier.

Cheers, LT.