D&D General How do you like your ASIs?

[JiffyPopTart]

If fixed ASIs are indeed gone, this absolutely needs to happen. From system aesthetic perspective having both point buy and completely floating ASIs is terrible. It is effectively two different point buys stacked on top of each other for no reason. Stuff like this gives me hives.


Interesting you feel that way! I kinda feel ASIs are the non-random version of that. Why would randomness make it acceptable to you and what the troupe play has to do with it?

Floating ASI with Point Buy is indeed a super waste of time but floating with an array let's you get a bit of customization.

 

[Minigiant]

Other

All of the above.

 

[Jfdlsjfd]

If I were to decide for one official rules only, I'd do fixed ASIs, including negatives. It's easier to ignore a rule than establish a new one. If the designers used it express the theme of a race, it's easier to have it written down already. Especially when it isn't all that clear. What an Owlfin innately good at? I am not sure and I'd like to be helped by the designers -- a null ASI being a possibility as well.

 

[Maxperson]

Racial abilities + racial ASIs > either one of those alone. You can even do +2 racial and +2 floating to it's the best of both worlds and is a compromise that takes everyone into account.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

And this is what I'm talking about when I say that folks around here speak as if they know the absolute truth, when what they have is personal opinion.

You're not wrong but I think it is fair to say that the current implementation of ASIs are one of the few systems in 5E that has a ton of detractors or at least people who would like it changed (in admittedly various different ways), but very few people who are like "This is perfect just as is!". Not none though.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

You're not wrong but I think it is fair to say that the current implementation of ASIs are one of the few systems in 5E that has a ton of detractors or at least people who would like it changed (in admittedly various different ways), but very few people who are like "This is perfect just as is!". Not none though.

Yep. I'm not really a fan how they 'fixed' the issue in Tasha's but then again I don't use the PHB system either and houseruled the whole thing for my own game.

I think any proper fix should begin by answering to two questions: 1) what is the purpose of races 2) what is the purpose of ability scores.

 

[Vaalingrade]

Just give a +2 you put anywhere, a free +2 like every... 5? levels and thne lets feats be feats without having to share resources with boring numbers.

 

[jmartkdr2]

Vegan: I'd rather give up ability scores entirely, to be honest.

But if we have to have them, no racial ASIs. They cause more problems than they solve; definitely a net negative.

 

[Umbran]

You're not wrong but I think it is fair to say that the current implementation of ASIs are one of the few systems in 5E that has a ton of detractors or at least people who would like it changed (in admittedly various different ways), but very few people who are like "This is perfect just as is!". Not none though.

So, I ask you - where are you getting your sample for that impression?

And, before you answer, do we need to discuss representative samples and the bias that arises because people who are happy with a thing will not feel a need to speak about it?

 

[Charlaquin]

Interesting you feel that way! I kinda feel ASIs are the non-random version of that. Why would randomness make it acceptable to you and what the troupe play has to do with it?

I’m glad you asked! For me it’s about what race is, as a game construct, in the type of old-school play I’m using “troupe play” as a shorthand for, as opposed to the style of play that has come to be sort of the default mode of play these days.

To illustrate what I mean, take a typical modern D&D game. An adventure or series of adventures focused on the exploits of a regular cast of characters, often with some sort of overarching narrative structure. PCs are typically exceptional individuals, so what is true of a given PC doesn’t really tell us anything about a typical person in the setting. In this mode of play, I don’t see race mechanics as representative of the typical member of a given lineage, any more than class mechanics are representative of the typical member of a given profession. These game mechanics give the players rules for how to express their individual character, they don’t inform us about the setting.

Contrast this with old school “troupe play” where the campaign is not a series of interconnected adventures but a shared play space. The game doesn’t focus on a regular cast of characters, the characters and even the players may be different from one play session to the next. In this style of play, players don’t so much create characters, as an author might. They generate characters through procedural mechanics that are indeed reflective of what a typical person in the setting looks like. 10-11 being the average ability score is not an arbitrary fact, it’s a direct result of the procedure for generating ability scores. In this paradigm, racial mechanics (and for that matter, class mechanics) don’t just inform you of what your unique elf character can do, they set the parameters for the procedural engine to simulate picking a random person from a representative sample of the general elf population.

Does that make sense?