How important is it to you or your players for characters to feel "overpowered"?

[TiQuinn]

Without doing the bolded, how can you play those monsters with any integrity?

You can play the monsters impartially and still be happy with the PC’s victory over them.

 

[Lanefan]

Here's the definition that I found: "a Greek dish of roasted meat served in a pita, usually with tomato, onion, and tzatziki, a cold, creamy sauce made from yogurt, cucumber, garlic, and various spices." I hope that helps.

Yeah, I've played many a character who ended up matching this "Greek dish of roasted meat" definition quite well.

 

[Thomas Shey]

Probably. But it's only a problem when not everyone at the table is wanting the same kind of game

Though its not uncommon for them to think they do, but their understanding of what that is differs.

 

[Thomas Shey]

To be fair. Most games are built around combat and in a world where antihero's are as revered as hero's, you can probably substitute the two interchangeably and the conversations validity holds

That was part of my point, but you can have a whole lot of interim cases too (people who are not full blown antiheroes but are badly enough flawed a lot of people wouldn't consider them heroes, but are still clearly protagonists of the story and thus "heroes" for some purposes).

 

[Thomas Shey]

Without doing the bolded, how can you play those monsters with any integrity?

Automate them. Have a set of rules they work under that fit what they're about, but otherwise don't particularly commit to them.

 

[KYRON45]

"Villain" tier is just the evil version of "hero" tier, isn't it?

Hero is the male version of the far better-known Greek name Hera.

And not all PCs are heroes.

Nah - your character should be your character. If it happens to inspire anyone else then fine, and if it doesn't, so what?

We weren't debating IF your character SHOULD be a hero,
Like all of the devolving spiral of tedium threads here end up being we were DEFINING the word hero.
If you don't want to be a hero, don't be. That's fun too.
For someone to say "this phrase i want to argue about for no real reason" is so broad that it's meaningless...is truly...no matter what word i use we'd end up defining that too.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Automate them. Have a set of rules they work under that fit what they're about, but otherwise don't particularly commit to them.

That seems to remove the idea of the DM from the situation. Not really what I'm looking for in tabletop.

 

[aramis erak]

I've never seen anything more pedantic in my life.
1. Every PC is their own protagonist.

Not true. I've had PCs where I clearly decided to NOT be the protagonist, just the side kick. I'd rather play Joxer than Herc or Aeolius... and it's pretty clear Joxer knows he's not the protagonist of the stories he's in...

2. 98.6% of all "rules" are based on combat or battle. No i do not have data for this.
3. The fact there is a "hero tier" and not a "villain tier" should tell you something.
4. I'm pretty sure all of the Greeks had/have names they take personally.
5. All PCs are PCs so i'm not sure what this means.

Some games use the term Hero for PCs, and some other term (often Monster) for any NPC or critter. Even when the campaign is playing evil characters or non-heroic characters.

6. This is when the term is used derogatively.

Blame Patton. His use. D-Day inspiration speech. I'm just noting it because I've used it in that derogation mode.

7. Your character should be the character whos inspiring other characters.

BULL!!! that's a one true-wayism that, IMO, needs to die. Sometimes it's fun to be the bad guys, and often it's fun to be the morally grey antiheroic protagonist.

The fact that everyone parses the meaning of everything is just tedious.

No more ridiculous than assuming everyone should have only one particular meaning for a word that's gone through at least 4 languages with different meanings in the last 1500 years and then whinging about people having issues withone insisting one's preferred meaning is the only meaning. I've used all of those within the last month or two.

English has very few words without multiple definitions, get used to it, as it's only getting worse with time.

 

[KYRON45]

Not true. I've had PCs where I clearly decided to NOT be the protagonist, just the side kick. I'd rather play Joxer than Herc or Aeolius... and it's pretty clear Joxer knows he's not the protagonist of the stories he's in...

Some games use the term Hero for PCs, and some other term (often Monster) for any NPC or critter. Even when the campaign is playing evil characters or non-heroic characters.

Blame Patton. His use. D-Day inspiration speech. I'm just noting it because I've used it in that derogation mode.

BULL!!! that's a one true-wayism that, IMO, needs to die. Sometimes it's fun to be the bad guys, and often it's fun to be the morally grey antiheroic protagonist.

No more ridiculous than assuming everyone should have only one particular meaning for a word that's gone through at least 4 languages with different meanings in the last 1500 years and then whinging about people having issues withone insisting one's preferred meaning is the only meaning. I've used all of those within the last month or two.

English has very few words without multiple definitions, get used to it, as it's only getting worse with time.

It’s ok. Just don’t be a hero. No one will even know.

 

[Wolfpack48]

It’s ok. Just don’t be a hero. No one will even know.

All this arguing about the word “hero” is really making me glad I said “overpowered” instead.