How Much is That Fighter in the Window?

[Hella_Tellah]

3.X doesn't handle hirelings and minions well. A druid with a fleshraker animal companion might be dangerous, but a druid that traveled the countryside amassing an army of critters using Wild Empathy is broken and annoying to run. Worse still, any druid can amass a critter coterie with sufficient dilligence and a patient party. Beguilers can likewise dominate their way into superstardom, while any charismatic character with Leadership can amass a huge, volunteer army.

And that's just on mechanical class abilities. As far as the rules are concerned, there's no codified method for hiring on extra hands. Can I spend all my phat lewts on an army of level-one commoners? How much would that cost? What do I pay to have a level 6 rogue come search for traps? The DMG II has some hapharzard rules, but not the sort of codified, balanced system one would hope for.

So how should 4e change that? Here's a simple system, as a starting suggestion. Assuming feats are still in, I present the new Leadership feats:

Leadership [General]
Prerequisites: Warlord level 5, any other class level 10
The character may lead up to three additional humanoids into battle. The total level of these creatures may not exceed [(1/2 Character Level)+CHA bonus]. Each humanoid requires 10gp per level in upkeep each day.

Wild Leadership [General]
Prerequisites: Druid level 5, Ranger level 5, any other class level 10
The character may lead up to three animals or magical beasts into battle. The total level of these creatures may not exceed [(1/2 Character Level)+CHA bonus]. Each creature requires 10gp per level in upkeep each day.

Undead Leadership [General]
Prerequisites: Evil, Cleric level 5, Wizard level 5, any other class level 10
The character may lead up to three undead creatures into battle. The total level of these creatures may not exceed [(1/2 Character Level)+CHA bonus]. Each creature requires 10gp per level in upkeep each day.

Based on this, spells like dominate humanoid and command undead could replace those feats temporarily or reduce upkeep costs.

What do you guys think? How would you fix hirelings for 4th Edition?

 

[drothgery]

I'd remove all hirelings, animal companions, and summoning or summoning-like spells and powers from PH1, so that all players are running only one character .

 

[Rechan]

I'd remove all hirelings, animal companions, and summoning or summoning-like spells and powers from PH1, so that all players are running only one character .

And that makes me sad.

I love my familiar, companions, homoculi, etc.

 

[Slife]

Untrained laborers cost, IIRC, 1 sp per day to hire. It's in the SRD.

 

[Hella_Tellah]

Untrained laborers cost, IIRC, 1 sp per day to hire. It's in the SRD.

Right, but that's not really the same thing. How much does it cost to hire a level 6 rogue? Or to rent a griffon for the weekend?

 

[Fifth Element]

Right, but that's not really the same thing. How much does it cost to hire a level 6 rogue? Or to rent a griffon for the weekend?

The rental isn't too much, but the insurance is a killer.

 

[Goken100]

I don't think that the old Leadership feat is unbalanced, it's just annoying at times. Having a troup of level 1 dudes follow you around all the time takes a lot of game time. But I don't think the answer is limiting the absolute number of followers.

The answer, if there is one, is to encourage adventuring with just a few folks while still encouraging building a large following (for guarding the keep and whatnot). Maybe the answer is that large groups of people aren't mobile and cause a lot of fuss and notice. Heck, that's the excuse they always use in video games!

 

[Wormwood]

I'd remove all hirelings, animal companions, and summoning or summoning-like spells and powers from PH1, so that all players are running only one character .

100% agreement.

I love sitting on my hands while someone plays his character, his summoned animals, plus his animal companion.

Thrilling.

 

[I'm A Banana]

I'd automate it.

Say you hire a 1st level fighter. Let's say he adds +6 to damage on your turn. Just automatically, as he attacks what you attack.

Say you have a boar companion. Maybe he adds +2 to your AC. Just by standing around in front of you.

If you give up YOUR action, you can issue commands to your companion to activate their special abilities. You can command a fighter to use a feat, or the boar to attack. But then it's turn takes the place of yours -- you don't both get to go.

 

[gothmaugCC]

Sigh....

You guys depress me. What ever happened to characters aspiring to owning thier own castle, or starting a monostary? In second edition these things were intregrated into the base character class. 3rd edition implemented it as a feat. In BOTH cases, its up to you DM to regulate and PLAY those followers/cohorts/hirelings. The PC can ask them to do something, but its the dm's decision if they actually DO them. To omany dm's just gave total control over to thier players, and once that happens the followers lose free will.

Great your druid makes freinds with dozens of forest animals. Great...They are still wild animals, wont go near a town, dont like fire, and will flee from most things they consider threats. Last time I checked, just about every wild animal on earth flees at the sight of approaching humans. So wonderful, you made freinds with 20 deer, 5 wolves and a bear. None of them get along with each other, and they run the first time a monster jumps out and goes "Boo".

Same with followers. They are not going to commit suicide for a player character, and if treated badly they LEAVE. Also they expect to gt paid, and paid well. Have them ask for hazard pay. The level 1 mook you hired for 1 sp a day is going to give you the bird and leave if you demand that he carries a torch into the dungeon. Think of all the movies you've seen where the hirelings take off at the first sign of danger. Sure they go drink with you, and polish your sword in town, but is the average mook going to enter a dungeon or spooky lair? I don't think so

DM's need to flex thier muscles a bit, read the rules, and do thier job. If you don't take the lazy way out, and actually PLAY npc's then you won't have an issue.