How ubiquitous is the Superior Weapon feat?

[DracoSuave]

I think that one of the reasons you see 'ubiquitous' feats such as Weapon Focus, Versatile Expertise, and Superior Weapon Focus is that they are designed to work simply and for any character.

So, in your party, sure every character might take expertise eventually, and only one might take, say... Pacifist Healer...


...but only one -wants- Pacifist Healer for his build. That guy's not taking the feats the Barbarian is to charge better, or the feats the Avenger takes to toughen himself up, or the feats the Wizard's taking to make his control better.

 

[Starfox]

IMC, at level 27, 5 characters (rogue, fighter, swordmage, bard, warlock) - and none of them use a superior weapon. Don't know why really, and I did suggest it to them. Guess they found better options.

And yes, I've banned the Expertise feats.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

IMC, at level 27, 5 characters (rogue, fighter, swordmage, bard, warlock) - and none of them use a superior weapon. Don't know why really, and I did suggest it to them. Guess they found better options.

And yes, I've banned the Expertise feats.

That's probably a pretty extreme example, but its quite possible to make builds of any of those classes that won't use a superior weapon, though swordmage certainly seems like one that would pretty much always want to go that route and probably a lot of bards as well.

 

[Obryn]

That's probably a pretty extreme example, but its quite possible to make builds of any of those classes that won't use a superior weapon, though swordmage certainly seems like one that would pretty much always want to go that route and probably a lot of bards as well.

Depends on your Swordmage - especially on how many [W] powers they have. Generally, they are much better off with Weapon Focus for most levels, assuming a pretty good mix.

If you're a Shielding Swordmage and your bread & butter attack is Sword Burst, Superior Weapons don't matter that much.

-O

 

[Mengu]

For any weapon build (that uses [W]'s for damage), superior weapon is going to be a tempting option at some point.

I tried to purposefully delay and resist the temptation, just making a few quick characters. For some characters, I can resist no more than level 4 or so (strikers). For others, I can resist till 10 (some defenders and leaders). Rarely, I can resist till 21 (again, defenders and leaders). But barring few exceptions such as dagger users, shortsword tempests, scimitar dancers, some goliaths, some eladrins who like longswords, and probably a few I'm missing, the temptation for superior weapon is very strong, and focus becomes tempting at paragon (earlier for multi-attackers).

It's also a factor of how feat starved your build is. Leaders who want to focus on a lot of healing via multiclass, picking powers from other classes, dipping into skill powers, etc, may not be able to afford to spend a feat on a superior weapon for a long time. Similarly, defenders who are dedicated to tanking and improving their marks and opportunity attacks have a lot of feats they can go for, before getting around to weapon upgrades (though getting a weapon upgrade is always a better option than a damage buff to opportunity or interrupt attacks). There just comes a time in every character's career, where you start looking at conditional damage buffs, and realize, superior weapon and weapon focus will trump any conditional damage boost you can get.

 

[Marshall]

Depends on your Swordmage - especially on how many [W] powers they have. Generally, they are much better off with Weapon Focus for most levels, assuming a pretty good mix.

If you're a Shielding Swordmage and your bread & butter attack is Sword Burst, Superior Weapons don't matter that much.

-O

...and some of the best weapons for Swordmages arent "superior", or more accurately, Swordmages dont have any "superior" weapon upgrades available. The only even viable option is Bastard Sword to go for a +1 average damage per [W]. Other "superior" option cost class features.

The best option is to go with a Khopesh and take "Deadly Axe" as your superior weapon feat.

 

[Felon]

But, all things being equal, a weapon-primary heroic-level PC is better off with a Superior Weapon than with Weapon Focus. If you have even one 2[W] power, or if your Superior weapon is more valuable than a +1 to average damage, the math is easy for Superior, IMO. At Paragon, the situation changes if most of your powers are 1[W], and at Epic ... well, you have both by now, more than likely.

Yeppers.

And on a crit, a superior weapon totally clobbers Weapon Focus.

 

[Felon]

...and some of the best weapons for Swordmages arent "superior", or more accurately, Swordmages dont have any "superior" weapon upgrades available.

One is all you really need, and bastard sword serves just fine.

 

[Obryn]

...and some of the best weapons for Swordmages arent "superior", or more accurately, Swordmages dont have any "superior" weapon upgrades available. The only even viable option is Bastard Sword to go for a +1 average damage per [W]. Other "superior" option cost class features.

The best option is to go with a Khopesh and take "Deadly Axe" as your superior weapon feat.

Well, I think Bastard Sword is still a great investment for Assault Swordmages who are expected to make a lot more basic attacks. (Heck; I'd go Fullblade, but YMMV.) Khopesh + Deadly Axe can work, but since most Swordmages don't have the stats to take the expanded critical feats, I don't value the High Crit property all that highly for them. I'd rather spend that same feat for +1 to hit.

I guess my main point is that any discussion of the relative merits of Weapon Focus and Superior Weapon gets really muddied for the Swordmage, whereas they're much clearer for classes which don't use their primary weapon as their casting implement.

-O

 

[Starfox]

What the Swordmage IMC actually uses is TWF/TWD with a parrying dagger and dual implement mastery. Costly in feats, extra damage, +1 Ref (compared to a 1h weapon).

And there, you caught me - Parrying dagger IS a superior weapon!

And yes, I banned the double sword too, sh she couldn't pick that.