How vulnerable are familiars?

[kreynolds]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: How vulnerable are familiars?

I wasn't trying to twig you or anything. Just pointing out that the Ky Rin didn't say "The Haversack", or mention it as magic, and thus you might have caused confusion.

Imagine yourself as a lurker who's reading for information, and hadn't memorized the DMG magic items list. And all of a sudden this guy is talking about magic out of nowhere...

Well, if I was a lurker, first I would pay attention instead of jumping to conclusions, thus I would be prompted to ask, "Haversacks are magical?", in which case it would be clarified as "Not all of them. There is a specific item in the DMG that...".

Also, if we're gonna get into semantics, I'd like to point out that a Haversack is only mentioned as magical equipment. The mundane version is called, quite simply, a backpack. He said "haversack", thus I replied along the lines of HHH.

 

[0-hr]

Ok, so familiars get full cover and virtual immunity to area of effect spells, and yet still grant Alertness, while hidden away? I ask this both as a DM and as someone starting a wizard in a new campaign...

And from now on, to avoid confusion, I will refer to the (magical) Hewards Handy Haversack as simple "H3". That should make it simple for the lurkers (or did you mean "Lurkers"?).

 

[Pax]

[edit]
n/m ... should have read more first, it was already all said ...
[/edit]

 

[Caliban]

Ok, so familiars get full cover and virtual immunity to area of effect spells, and yet still grant Alertness, while hidden away? I ask this both as a DM and as someone starting a wizard in a new campaign...

Due to the fact that carried items are considered to be undamaged by area affect spells unless you roll a natural 1, yes. (If the familiar was vulnerable to fire damage while inside your pocket, you would have to explain how the familiar get's toasted while leaving your shirt untouched...)

However, I wouldn't allow the familiar to grant the Alertness bonus while in an extradimensional space, such as a bag of holding or Haversack (not to mention the fact that items such as that have a limited air supply). The space created by the spell "Familiar Pocket" would be an exception to this.

 

[Thanee]

Really? I wouldn't allow the Alertness feat while the familiar is in his pocket as well. It's just an extra-dimensional space like any other, altho created for a specific purpose.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Lucius Foxhound]

Really? I wouldn't allow the Alertness feat while the familiar is in his pocket as well. It's just an extra-dimensional space like any other, altho created for a specific purpose.

Remember that not all pockets are extra-dimentsional space. However, I would rule that ALL haversacks are magical. I believe Heward copyrighted the word "haversack."

 

[Thanee]

Oh you are right, I'm referring to the familiar pocket only, of course.

Bye
Thanee

 

[dcollins]

I believe Heward copyrighted the word "haversack."

Not all intellectual property is copyright.
I believe you meant "trademarked".

 

[KarinsDad]

My take on this:

1) If any creature is on your body, be it a Familiar or you carrying the unconscious Rogue, it doesn't matter. Area effect spells still affect them. They are not carried items, they are carried creatures.

2) T&B rules mean nothing to me. If you have the Familiar in a container which can supply cover, then it gets a cover bonus. Such an item could be a chest, but not a normal pocket. Acid from Acid Fog would still seep through a normal pocket. And, I can care less about the logic concerning items not affected by spells unless you roll a one rule. That is a totally non-logical rule there for ease of playability, it should not be used in a logical discussion. In other words, yes, the pocket is protected (due to the non-logical rule) even though the Familiar in the pocket is toasted (due to a logical rule). In reality, both should get toasted. But, PCs would be running around naked a lot if you did that.

3) If you have a Familiar in an extra-dimensional area such as a Bag of Holding, a Familiar Pouch or whatever, then they are not within arms length of you and will not supply you with Alertness, etc.

4) If you have a Familiar in a box, then they are within arms length of you and by a strict interpretation of the rules, they would supply you with Alertness, etc. However, I think common sense should apply here. If the cover is 100%, then in my game, the Wizard would not gain Alertness. If the cover is less than 100%, then the Familiar can have his eyes and ears sticking out and Alertness would be granted.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

IMO, the "Familiar Pocket" doesn't really matter.

Your familiar will survive any Reflex save effect that doesn't kill you, unless you've got Evasion or Improved Evasion.

The familiar is dead if your opponent casts Horrid Wilting. There is no cover against that spell, and it forces a Fortitude save. It also does enough damage to probably kill the familiar.