How Would You Defend A Mountain Fortress?

[Maldur]

supplies are less of an issue as every legionair carries his own foodsupply.

Posioning wells and waterstreams will make casualties as well.

Use lost of traps, it stalls the advancing army. Also use stealthy ( or teleporting) troops to trap, "cleared" areas.

They do have a lot of magic item, so magic dead zones would help. Magic wild zones could create confusions as well.



Also stealing/destroying their banners would damage moral, especially if SHARK uses my suggestions in the 'reading group' thread.

 

[Tiberius]

Shark, how do you rule on the controlling portion of the Gate spell? It seems to me that if you are able to Gate in a solar or planetar and force them to fight the legions, it would be a good idea regardless of the sucess of the mission. If you send them after high-level characters and they win, great. If not, Gate is of the Calling subschool, so the dead solar is truly dead. Either way, you destroy a powerful minion of good.

Further abusing Gate, the master of the fortress, or his minions, could bring Abominations (from the ELH) to bear upon his foes. I'd love to see the legions deal with creatures with DR from +7 to +12.

I've developed an epic spell which might be useful, if the range were increased:
Vecna's Touch (rename as appropriate)
Necromancy
Spellcraft DC: 80
Components: V,S,DF,XP
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: 300 feet
Target: Several living creatures within a 40' radius spread
Save: Fortitude Partial
Seeds: Slay (DC 25, base), Animate Dead (23)
Factors: 40 total HD raised (+10), 1 action (+20), touch to area [spread](+14), 40' radius (+10)
Mitigating Factors: Creates wraiths (-2), 1000 XP burn (-10), 10d6 backlash (-10)

This spell causes all living creatures with less than 80 Hit Dice to be slain. Those slain will be immediately animated as wraiths, until 40 total hit dice of wraith have been animated. These wraiths are permanantly controlled by the caster. Those who make their save suffer 3d6 + 20 damage. The caster suffers a 10d6 backlash.

XP cost: 1000

I may have done the math wrong, and I am working off of some notes here, so let me know if I've made errors, please.

One could probably create a spell based off of the Destroy seed (with its 12,000 foot range) that targetted magical items within an area. 20d6 damage is enough to destroy most powerful, fragile magic items, such as potions, wands, scrolls, staves, etc.

-Tiberius

[EDIT: changed 40 HD slain to the proper 80 HD slain]

 

[Broken Fang]

Ouch...just one more reason fo rme not to get the ELH. My players have a hard time with the spells in the PHB.

 

[Crowe9107]

Sorry for the lateness of my post, real life made a sneak attack.

Why'd you think it was too powerful?

Eh...I suppose power is a relative term...I would feel kind of bad unleashing these things on a party of 5th level characters. 80 5th level centurions, may be another story. This really is the Galleran version of the Hind attack helicopter, though I can't for the life of me imagine how something that heavily armored would be able to fly.

I whipped one up in pcgen and here is what I got:

M Bulette Beast9 CR 9; Size:H Type Beast|DRAGON; HD (9d10)+54; hp 104; Init +2 (+2 Dex, +0 Misc); Spd Walk 40', Burrow 10', Fly 40'; AC 26 (flatfooted 24, touch 12), Bite (Natural/Primary) +16 0'/BPS (2d8+12 20/x2 Neither H ) or Claw (Natural/Secondary) +11/+11 0'/PS (2d6+6 20/x2 Neither H ) or ; SA: 60 foot Line of Lightning 6d8(18) 1/day (2), Immune to Paralysis (2),Dragon Wings (2),Immune to Electricity (2),Immune to Sleep (2),Leap(Ex),Scent(Ex),Tremorsense(Ex); Vision: Darkvision (60'),Normal,Tremorsense (60') AL: LE; Sv: Fort +12, Ref +8, Will +4; Str 35, Dex 14, Con 23, Int 4, Wis 12, Cha 8

Skills and Feats: ;
Possessions: 1 Bite (Natural/Primary), 1 Claw (Natural/Secondary),

That is pretty close to what I got, PCGen apparently doesn't upgrade the HD, and as a half-dragon, it is allowed a feat per 4HD. Here is my original version.

Blue Steelhorn

Huge Dragon
Hit Dice: 9d12+54 (110 HP)
Initiative: +2 (Dex)
Speed: 40ft., burrow 10 ft., fly 40ft.
AC: 26 (-2 Size, +2 Dex, +16 Natural)
Attacks: Bite +12 melee, 2 claws +7 melee or gore +12 melee, 2 claws +7 melee
Damage: Bite 2d8+8, gore 2d8+8, claw 2d8+4
Face/Reach: 10 ft. by 20 ft./10 ft.
Special Attacks:Leap, Breath Lightning 1/day (6d8 damage, 5x5x60 ft.)
Special Qualities: Tremor Sense, Immune to Lightning, Paralysis, and Sleep; Darkvision 60’, Low-Light Vision 60’ft
Saves: Fort +12, Ref +8, Will +4
Abilities: Str 35, Dex 15, Con 22, Int 4, Wis 13, Cha 8
Skills: Jump, Listen
Feats: Power Attack, Improved Bullrush
Climate/Terrain: Any warm or hot; underground
Organization: Solitary or Pair
Challenge Rating: 9
Treasure: None
Alignment: Always Lawful Evil
Advancement: 10-16 HD (Huge), 17-27 HD (Gargantuan)

They are only a CR of 9 so why would they be hard to make?

All of those special qualities get a tad expensive in the spell formula, EACH, doubles the cost of the relevant seed, even though they are not particularly powerful. The lightning attack seems a bit mean, seeing how these things are supposed to charge tight formations of troops, and a line of these opening up with lightning could definately soften things up. The dig is real nice, IMHO probably the most useful ability the creature has, it allows it to double as an engineering vehicle, digging trenches, dig in from incoming artillery, build concealed positions, and tunnel underneath walls. The version I did stripped the specials and added DR 15+1, pretty mean, but with that kind of armor, I think it SHOULD be able to snap set spears. Flight was taken off too.

Huge Dragon
Hit Dice: 9d12+54 (110 HP)
Initiative: +2 (Dex)
Speed: 40ft., burrow 10 ft.,
AC: 26 (-2 Size, +2 Dex, +16 Natural)
Attacks: Bite +12 melee, 2 claws +7 melee or gore +12 melee, 2 claws +7 melee
Damage: Bite 2d8+8, gore 2d8+8, claw 2d8+4
Face/Reach: 10 ft. by 20 ft./10 ft.
Special Attacks:
Special Qualities: DR 15/+1
Saves: Fort +12, Ref +8, Will +4
Abilities: Str 35, Dex 15, Con 22, Int 4, Wis 13, Cha 8
Skills: Listen, Spot
Feats: Power Attack, Improved Bullrush
Climate/Terrain: Any warm or hot; underground
Organization: Solitary or Pair
Challenge Rating: 9
Treasure: None
Alignment: Always Lawful Evil
Advancement: 10-16 HD (Huge), 17-27 HD (Gargantuan)

I guess if you wanted the True Half-Dragon/Bullette, you could burn the DC for the Extra Special Qualities, you wouldn't have to make many of them, just enough to get a sucessful breeding program going.
Why am I feeling sorry for the good guys? I must be nuts!

Re,

Carl Rowe

 

[Leopold]

Crowe: Yeah PCGen has not been able to handle the HD jump I think . I think it might be fixed but the hit points came on very close.



As far as these things charging into combat as shock troops the best thing would be to have these mounted by the vampire lords in gaseous form and when they rise up from teh ground blast with lightning and have the vampires spell casting.


20 of these would cause terror in the ranks as you would be coming from below to above. doing this will split the ranks of the enemy. Follow this up by purple worms and you will be fighting a front on multiple fronts. Let the worms (neutral and immune to smite) fight on and on as the vamps and bulletes attack and dive like the sharks they are. or just burst through the air and start flying and then dive at the enemy. Remeber we are working on a 3 demensioanl battlefield so attacking from all sides up down left right, etc will sow confusion.

Also how are the valorean troops marching? Do they march like the romans do in a tight formation or are they the charge in type like the gauls? This makes a world of difference when planning attacks. Can we get any informaiton on how the soliders are structured and organized by legions or ranks?

 

[Crowe9107]

Very true. Those 350,000 medium-level Human Fighters of the Vallorean Legions are only facing 100,000 low-level Human Fighters and 26,000 medium-level Hobgoblin Fighters plus monstrous auxiliaries. It looks bad for Evil if it comes down to a square fight.

3:1 odds is about the minimum feasible force required for an assault. Their experience level as I understand it [Average Vallorean Legionaire is 5th Level, our Galleran Grunts about 2nd level], is a tremendous force mulitplier though, and we will be hard pressed to go toe-to-toe with Vallorean units on a conventional battlefield. Also, the Valloreans appear fairly integrated, while we have a mix of LE and CE forces, which reallistically would not work well together.

Our primary mission is to DELAY the Vallorean Forces and deny them the opportunity to link up and reinforce the Vallorean Main Body. Holing up in Fortress Indestructible will probably not accomplish this, the Valloreans will simply manuever around us, capture our 2 supporting cities, and mop us up later when they have the time and resources to dig us out. While our presence would threaten them, their occupying forces could meet us from defensive positions, and WE would be the ones needing 3:1 odds, probably even higher numbers than that given the Valloreans experience. Granted, those occupied cities should be unfriendly, but as the goody-goody's, it may be seen as a liberation as the common citizens won't have to worry about becoming blood donors for vampires, or werewolf chow under Vallorean rule. I think at the very least, the Vallorean Army will split,and strike both cities simultaneously, with possibly a third blocking force to meet any sally or counterattack from the Fortress. This, is how I would play it if I was the Valloreans. They may just charge the fortress first, concentrating their strength on the hardest objectives while they are fresh, and then work their way to the cities, but it sounds kind of masochistic to me. It is hard to predict without a clear idea of the Vallorean objectives and their mindset. I think we need to be looking outside of the fortress for a place to take out the Valloreans, the more territory they take, the harder it will be for us to get at them. I think, the Valloreans expect us to cower in front of their might and hide behind our walls. I think they are supremely confident of their abilities and the righteousness of their cause. If these things are correct, a well played ambush/trap not on their timetable in an unexpected location, could seriously disrupt their plans.

Thoughts?

Carl Rowe

 

[Crowe9107]

Crowe: Yeah PCGen has not been able to handle the HD jump I think . I think it might be fixed but the hit points came on very close.



As far as these things charging into combat as shock troops the best thing would be to have these mounted by the vampire lords in gaseous form and when they rise up from teh ground blast with lightning and have the vampires spell casting.


20 of these would cause terror in the ranks as you would be coming from below to above. doing this will split the ranks of the enemy. Follow this up by purple worms and you will be fighting a front on multiple fronts. Let the worms (neutral and immune to smite) fight on and on as the vamps and bulletes attack and dive like the sharks they are. or just burst through the air and start flying and then dive at the enemy. Remeber we are working on a 3 demensioanl battlefield so attacking from all sides up down left right, etc will sow confusion.

Also how are the valorean troops marching? Do they march like the romans do in a tight formation or are they the charge in type like the gauls? This makes a world of difference when planning attacks. Can we get any informaiton on how the soliders are structured and organized by legions or ranks?

Heh, that kind of combined arms mayhem makes me smile, evilly, wouldn't that be a nice suprise on a Vallorean encampment in the middle of the night....

As for Vallorean structure, I can't say exactly, but given SHARK's love of Caesar, I assume it is on the Roman model of 80 troops to a century, 2 centuries to a cohort 9-12 cohorts to a legion (although I believe SHARK mentioned 10,000man legions, so this may be erroneous). SHARK owes us lots of info...Gods, organization, etc etc, the more we know, the better we fight.

Re,

Carl Rowe

 

[Leopold]

Granted, those occupied cities should be unfriendly, but as the goody-goody's, it may be seen as a liberation as the common citizens won't have to worry about becoming blood donors for vampires, or werewolf chow under Vallorean rule.

or they could already be vampire and werewolves already! Have the city throw a huge frestival similar to the liberation of the Netherlands by the allied forces, banners, flowers, etc. all being thrown at the liberators. Once word is recieved that they have liberated both cities and split their forces up, the vanguard of werewolves and vamps wreck havoc on the rearguard retaking these cities from those that 'liberated them'. These would be 'expendable' troops and need to be considered as such.

With such forces harrying at the rear the might of the unified army can come back and smite them all without so much as a wave of the hand. The key strategy is timing. Once the main force is engaged with the fortress then the cities rise up and begin decimating the rear guard and the supply train. These forces will die and should be counted on as being lost. Anything they do to prevent reinforcements should be considered a bonus. This is a trojan horse strategy nonetheless, if it works great. If it fails, you lost some troops but you delayed the forces nonetheless.

They may just charge the fortress first, concentrating their strength on the hardest objectives while they are fresh, and then work their way to the cities, but it sounds kind of masochistic to me.

SHARK's players are smart. I think they will pull the divide and conquer manuever and take out the cities and then the keep. Antimagic shell and mass silence will be key to keeping this place isolated from the outside. Maybe some mindflayers to extract the information from the heads of the captured soliders to use this message information devices and reply to the main HQ "Sector 10 all clear" when in reality it's going poorly against the valloreans.

I think, the Valloreans expect us to cower in front of their might and hide behind our walls. I think they are supremely confident of their abilities and the righteousness of their cause. If these things are correct, a well played ambush/trap not on their timetable in an unexpected location, could seriously disrupt their plans.

Thoughts?

Carl Rowe [/B]

They are proud and arrogant but not stupid. Wise maybe but they believe their cause is just and will be victorious over the evil hordes. This mindset is simliar to Nazi Germany or Feudal Japan with the overal drive to stamp out those that are unlike them and make a new world in their own image. Hence, when dealing with these forces we should look on the ways that the allies dealt with them in WW2.

The tactics we use should reflect the terrain, i know it's mountainous but lets take the japanese and iwo jimafor instance. The japs were dug in like ticks into every square hole they could muster, tunnels ranged everywhere, mobility was key, there were no bottlenecks anywhere. They could effectively move all over the island unseen and unheard from the allies movements. If we could have a tunnel system that would mimic such a layout as this the denziens of darkness could move in around and wherever on the battlefield out of sight of the prying eyes of the valloreans.

Granted once they get in the tunnel system there needs to be countermeasures to prevent wide scale assualt with these but a simple measure of traps, magic mouths, wyvern watch spells would help protect those access ways.



SHARK we need more info. I am sending out an APB here now.

 

[mmadsen]

SHARK we need more info.

Ideally we'd get back an intelligence report, what we know about the Vallorean legions, their Witchhunters and Inquisitors, their Champions, etc.

What stories have come back about what the Witchhunters and Inquisitors do? Can we recognize them? Same with the Champions. What do we know about the legions' Standard Operating Procedures. I assume they set up a fortified camp every night. How is it protected? Or rather, what would we know about how it's protected?

 

[Leopold]

SHARK greatest troll evar