Sorcerers Apprentice
Hero
Regardless of everything else, wouldn't FR gods generally want a dead unbeliever to return to life, giving him one more chance to find religion instead of becoming another useless brick in the wall?
D&D 5E How would you handle raising dead on a PC that didn't believe in the gods?
- Thread starter transtemporal
- Start date
transtemporal
Explorer
A warlock can have a patron AND a faith. Warlocks aren't exclusive with their patron. They can see other entities. The only time it isn't going to work is if the warlocks patron is "The Guy Who Burns Down Trees" and the god they worship is "Treeguy".
transtemporal
Explorer
Yeah I guess that's probably true. Dibs on his soul and all that.
Leatherhead
Possibly a Idiot.
That really doesn't follow.
Warlock patrons, well like 2/3s of them anyway, have a plan for overthrowing the current established gods, and Warlocks are part of it. Unless you are only playing with fey pact warlocks (and even then, I am sure some fey entities run the "Screw the gods" flag), then they are doing something objectively worse than slapping the gods in the face, they are working against them to overthrow the godhood system.
Sorcerers Apprentice
Hero
Well, maybe so, but a tiny little deal with a minor devil on the side isn't going to upset the multiverse, as long as the gods don't find out about it all is good and you can be a devout worshipper.
Gardens & Goblins
First Post
If the character is not willing to return to the lands of the living, they don't.
Personally I'd find an atheist in a world where the gods actually exist a hard sell. I can imagine some distrust or skepticism for a while, but eventually those celestial agents, horned minions and clerical power are going to raise questions.
Sure, a player can insist on sticking to their beliefs, it could even be fun/funny after a while, a parody of modern day arguments, where the 'non-believer' dogmatically espouses The Truth, explaining away every actual-100%-divine event/happening in terms of SCIENCE!
But hey, it's their character -- they can spin it as they wish, we might disagree with the reasoning but the bottom line is that their character has willingly accept the resurrect spell.
Personally I'd find an atheist in a world where the gods actually exist a hard sell. I can imagine some distrust or skepticism for a while, but eventually those celestial agents, horned minions and clerical power are going to raise questions.
Sure, a player can insist on sticking to their beliefs, it could even be fun/funny after a while, a parody of modern day arguments, where the 'non-believer' dogmatically espouses The Truth, explaining away every actual-100%-divine event/happening in terms of SCIENCE!
But hey, it's their character -- they can spin it as they wish, we might disagree with the reasoning but the bottom line is that their character has willingly accept the resurrect spell.
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Ahrimon
Bourbon and Dice
How so? Everyone gets too fixated on the optional story of the warlock selling their soul. The pact could be as simple as you agree to do the patron's laundry once a week for a year in exchange for being taught the secret to power.
Also, nothing about the warlock says that you need your patron to keep gaining power. It's 100% within the book for the warlock to be learning these secrets on his own. The patron only showed him the path to power, it's not the source of his power.
Ahrimon
Bourbon and Dice
I don't see why they wouldn't. Hasn't the cleric proved his faith and abilities so far? So, one of the most devout followers asks for a spell with purity of purpose and belief in their heart, why wouldn't the god approve it? Then down the road if they misuse the gift, that should be caught in the post casting audit. Your deities do employ a large contingent of beings to audit all of the spells cast by their followers and report any discrepancies? If the cleric is found to be abusing their gifts then they should get a visit or have a revelation that explains to them how they have been misusing their gifts.
Sword of Spirit
Legend
While that is absolutely how I run it, it's worth mentioning that the Pact Boon feature received at 3rd level is described as a gift from your patron.
I don't do it that way because I don't like classes being on unequal footing. The way I do it, you might keep serving your patron because they can smash you like a bug if you don't, but you don't actually have to. Once you get hooked into the magic (ie, gain the class) you can run off to another world and level yourself up to 20th and then go defeat your patron and take their stuff. If the warlock doesn't feel like you're doing what it wants you to, it can act against you like any other NPC. It's just like breaking a contract with a powerful mortal after you've been paid. I do something similar with gods and clerics. Once the cleric is created, his access to divine magic is infused into him. If his god doesn't like what he does with it, he can discipline him however he sees fit (from warnings in dream and omens, to sending a planetar to smite him to dust), but he generally can't just turn off his spellcasting (I may make some exceptions to that).
MarkB
Legend
Fiends I'll give you, though even there their motivations vary. Great Old One, though? The whole point of those patrons is that their motivations are so incomprehensible that we have no idea what they really want. Maybe some of them consider the gods an impediment to their goals, maybe not. Some of them may not even believe in gods.
Ultimately, though, the warlock isn't investing any faith or belief in his patron. He is essentially entering into a business deal. He may be in complete disagreement with his patron's motives, and yet still be willing to trade with it.
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