I *almost* bought an Avalanche Press book

[Buttercup]

How can a picture offend you? At the magazine rack, more women's mags have naked or half naked women on the cover than men's mags. Ever heard the term "don't judge a book by its cover? Sounds like more pc bull crap to me.

America: The United States of the Offended. Someone is always offended by something. People* need to get over it.

* By people, I mean people in general, not anyone on the boards - see I had to have a disclaimer to avoid offending someone. Grrrr.

JRRN, I'm unclear about what point you're trying to make. Are you saying that people who have points of view other than your own are not entitled to them? Or are you saying that anyone you don't agree with is PC and therefore dismissing their opinion? Do you not understand or agree with Malessa's concern that certain images are not appropriate for children, and thus the covers of Avalanche books might keep parents from purchasing them? Or are you saying something else that I haven't thought of? Could you clarify please?

 

[Aloïsius]

This kind of thread is very exotic for me. Very strange. That a somewhat ridiculous cover may nearly start a flame war, and trolling about such or such country morality...

I found AP cover fun in some maner : they are like those movies during the 60 or 70, you know, those about the hollow earth, dinosaurs, etc, there was always a young amzone queen in distress wearing a small bikini. But whatever happens, their brushings and make-up were always perfect...

As for not buying a book because of its cover, I don't understand. I bought the MMII even while its cover is hideous, repulsive, offending, obnoxious, errr... %@fgjllsk !

As for boycoting a compagnie because of some book's covers... It sounds somewhat talibanish for me.

 

[jgbrowning]

As for boycoting a compagnie because of some book's covers... It sounds somewhat talibanish for me.

hehe, now here's a man who knows how to drop "loaded" words.

I'm not buying their books because i don't want to support their business. My decisions my seem silly or stupid to others, but the main reason **"I don't support things i don't like"** is the same one exercised by millions of people every day.

joe b.

 

[Bamphalas]

No one here has stated that others should NOT buy the books because they don't like them. In this thread people are discussing the reasons why they PERSONALLY would not buy the books (and perhaps none of AP's products). Toward the beginning of the thread some people have given reasons why they WOULD buy them. Some of you throwing out insults simply because you favor the product need to chill. If you love the covers, great. Tell us why you like them.

So far the reasons that people choose to not buy the products are:
1) May be inappropriate for children.
2) May be inappropriate in mixed company.
3) May be offensive to women. (Women looking to buy and significant others of men who buy.)
4) Quality of art.
5) Appropriateness of art for subject matter and/or genre.
There are others, but these are the ones I recall.

I love images of sexy women. I don't get offended by nudity or sexuality. However, I would not buy their books. Not because I find them offensive for their sexuality, but because I don't like their choice of art. I don't like the quality. I don't think they fit with the themes or even the hobby itself. I feel that if AP doesn't take their products seriously, why would I?

Each person's reason for or against buying the books are not wrong. Every reason is correct and appropriate for each individual. Let's try to remember that.

 

[TheAuldGrump]

Hmmmm, looking at A.P books that I have bought, or seriously considered buying:

Last days of Constantinople - no cheeesecake, somewhat ambiguous cover to content, but the golden city is recognizable.

Celtic Age - no cheescake, good, on topic art.

Little People - high cheesecake, only bought because of tie in with celtic age. Art not particularly on topic. (Pearl bikini? Come on!)

Noble Steeds - no cheesecake, on topic cover art,

Noble Nights - no cheesecake, on topic cover art.

Vlad the Impaler - Mild Cheesecake, but at least on topic and period
Hmmmm.....

Frankly, it isn't the cheesecake that prevents me from buying the books, I use miniatures from Reaper that are a LOT more graphic. (Take a look at their succubi sometime...) It is the fact that they are OFF TOPIC! No actual moral offense taken, but the costumes are out of period, and just plain silly. The covers that have grabbed me have been on topic, and in period - even the Vlad the Impaler one had period underwear (underwhere?) on the umm, cover girl. The only book of theirs that I have bought that has a cover that bothers me is Little People, and if it didn't tie in with Celtic Age it would still be sitting on the shelf.

In fact when I bought it the clerk made the comment 'your the only person who comes in here who actually buys these'.

Yes, I think they have their target audience wrong, I don't think that the 15-20 year old crowd as a whole is out shopping for historical settings.

However, I will make the observation that most of their latest product, Little People excepting, have been moving away from sophomore fantasy. Noble Steeds and Noble Knights both have good on topic cover art, as does Celtic Age.

So, if the folks at Avalanche are reading, please keep doing the on topic covers for the supplements, in the long run you'll get more business...

The Auld Grump, who IS a bit of a prude, but can seperate that from what is appropriate...

*Edit: Whoops! spoke too soon, just took a look at Viking Age...
You know, Norse ladies were a lot more likely to be naked than wear a swimsuit in the snow... Give me a break.*

 

[TheAuldGrump]

Oh, and Troll Lords, sorry, but the cover art for Book of familiars just doesn't grab me. I was sort of looking forward to the book, but the cover just puts me off. I will take a look at it anyway, just wanted to let you know. (In all honesty it's not just the gal on the cover, Horne has just never been one of my favorite artists.)

Also, just don't feel that every class should have access to familiars. Druids, certainly, rangers, quite possibly, esp. as they already get something similar. Fighters and rogues? Nah...

The Auld Grump

 

[davewoodrum]

I found AP cover fun in some maner : they are like those movies during the 60 or 70, you know, those about the hollow earth, dinosaurs, etc, there was always a young amzone queen in distress wearing a small bikini. But whatever happens, their brushings and make-up were always perfect...

I have to agree with you... I feel the same way about another AP book that I mentioned earlier for the same reasons... Endless Sands. To me Endless Sands is almost an accidental(?) tribute to a camp humor spin on the old go-go lounge...early John Waters almost.
I feel much the same way also about Aztecs: Empire Of The Dying Sun because even though the cover is coming close to risking dangerous cleavage exposure the woman is weilding two hand axes and some feathers in her hair.... Its hard to tell as to whether or not she plans to perform a little dance for you or cut out your still beating heart in a ritualistic ceremony... either way the cover comes close to literally screaming "Video Store.... VHS days... Action rack, $1 a night reduced special!!!"
Kinda brings back memories of sitting around in the basement watching USA: Up All Nite so many years ago...

 

[Sagan Darkside]

Very strange. That a somewhat ridiculous cover may nearly start a flame war, and trolling about such or such country morality...

It doesn't stop you from flaming, does it:

As for boycoting a compagnie because of some book's covers... It sounds somewhat talibanish for me.

No, if we wanted the publishers of those covers brought to a converted soccer field to be publically shot in the head, then it would be talibanish.

Not buying something because you disagree with it or the people who make it- thats being moral.

SD

 

[Default Name Player]

Default Name Player - show me in my comments where I'm trying to elevate the U.S. morally above other countries because of the prevalance or lack-thereof of pornography. Show me.

<snip>

And if you guys really want to debate me on this topic, feel free. But get your own facts right, and for god's sake, take a logic class.

die_kluge - We wouldn't even be having this conversation right now if you decided not to stereotype other countries and people, WAAAAAY earlier in this thread. Another poster called you on it, yet you decided to continue on that path despite such. Your recent response to me has been MUCH clearer - other countries more accepting about sex...see, nice and easy to the point - but you earlier posts were just way out of line and hinted at arrogance. Even a smiley face would have diffused the situation, but there was nothing like that in your early posts.

I usually just lurk, but I just can't stand that kind of hypocrisy and arrogance.

As for logic: we're posting on a RPG thread that involves fireballs and dragons. There's logic?

 

[jgbrowning]

As for logic: we're posting on a RPG thread that involves fireballs and dragons. There's logic?

Logic is a 9th-Level spell. Most of us will never get to it...


joe b.