I am forseeing problems with feats

[TarionzCousin]

Now, I've noticed a tendency for this thread to get rather silly...

I think 4E needs a grammar-related feat:

Golden Grammar Adept
Tier: Paragon Epic
Benefit: If you spend an Action Point you can name all figures of speech used in the encounter. Each will grant you +10 bonus on attack rolls

Noun, verb, adverb, adjective, pronoun... oh, wait. You said "figures," not "parts of speech." Dang. Never mind.

N.B. I could have used those +10's too!

 

[Voss]

Anyway, from the feats we've seen, feats will be so mechanically weak that balance problems won't be an issue. With the sole exception of class training, which, unless it limits you to very stupid options, will be a 'must have' character optimization-wise.

 

[Zsig]

Elven Precision [Elf]

Prerequisites: Elf, elven accuracy racial power, heroic tier
Benefit: When you use the elven accuracy power, you gain a +2 bonus to the new attack roll.

(Bill's Holiday Present )

I see somewhat 3 prerequisites there. Even though it's a racial feat, they are still requirements nonetheless... other than "heroic, paragon and epic".

 

[Sitara]

True, as I said other 'feats'ay be pre-reqs. But keep in mind its a racial feat, which are different from standard feats. (for one, ALL racial feats will, rather obviously require you to be a memeber of a certain race...)

Oh and btw, in response to a previous poster, who says paragon and epic paths will take up feat slots? From what we gather, all pc's will have paragon and epic paths, they will be automatically tacked onto your charcter once you hit a certain level. It wont take up a talent/power/feat slot.

 

[Oldtimer]

Its effectively just Improved Toughness though. You get 1 per HD in both. You get an extra 3 in 4th edition because you get an extra 3 HD.

3 extra HD? I've seen speculation about triple hit points at first level (per SWSE), but quadruple hit points? What's your source for that?

 

[Dausuul]

Elven Precision [Elf]

Prerequisites: Elf, elven accuracy racial power, heroic tier
Benefit: When you use the elven accuracy power, you gain a +2 bonus to the new attack roll.

(Bill's Holiday Present )

I see somewhat 3 prerequisites there. Even though it's a racial feat, they are still requirements nonetheless... other than "heroic, paragon and epic".

Yes, but those prereqs are no-brainers. A feat that improves the elven accuracy ability is kinda useless if you don't have elven accuracy. It'd be like a fighter picking up metamagic feats. And obviously "elf" is a prerequisite for an elven racial feat.

Neither of these prerequisites is being used as a balancing device.

 

[Ulorian - Agent of Chaos]

Elven Precision [Elf]

Prerequisites: Elf, elven accuracy racial power, heroic tier
Benefit: When you use the elven accuracy power, you gain a +2 bonus to the new attack roll.

(Bill's Holiday Present )

I see somewhat 3 prerequisites there. Even though it's a racial feat, they are still requirements nonetheless... other than "heroic, paragon and epic".

Well, it's two really. Elves automatically get the elven accuracy racial power, so it's impossible to have either of the first two prerequisites without having the other. So the prerequisites are: heroic tier and being a member of a specific race. Seeing as this is a racial feat, I don't see the problem.

 

[carmachu]

As Mike said himself a while back now, you are only seeing one tiny portion of the game, without being able to compare it to all other aspects.

Once the rulebooks come out, we shall see how things are looking.

And thats not folk in discussions fault.

You can only discuss what we have seena nd heard....if you only show part of the rules, you cant complain that folks are jumping to conclusions, and not comparing it to other aspects.

 

[Dausuul]

And thats not folk in discussions fault.

You can only discuss what we have seena nd heard....if you only show part of the rules, you cant complain that folks are jumping to conclusions, and not comparing it to other aspects.

This is true to an extent. I do think it's silly to assume the mechanics that have been revealed are the only ones that will be changing, and everything else stays as is. It's much more reasonable to try to extrapolate based on the mechanics we've seen.

That said, it's ridiculous to say that we shouldn't complain or criticize when we see something that looks like a problem, just because we don't see the big picture. Big picture or not, now is when our criticisms might alert the designers to a problem they'd overlooked. If we wait to see what the big picture looks like, it'll be too late to do anything about it.

 

[Fifth Element]

And thats not folk in discussions fault.

You can only discuss what we have seena nd heard....if you only show part of the rules, you cant complain that folks are jumping to conclusions, and not comparing it to other aspects.

But by jumping to conclusions, you're not only discussing what you have seen and heard. You're looking at what you've seen and heard - the small portion of the rules we have seen - and filling in gaps in your mind, with little to go on.

The point is, why the worry and gnashing of teeth now? Why can't we wait until we actually have the rules to analyze the rules? There are many things that we can legitimately discuss about 4E right now, but the rules aren't one of them, since we know so little about them.