Pathfinder 1E I get the feeling Paizo isn't worried about Wizards of the Coast.

[DaveMage]

I'm certainly a Pathfinder fan, but I agree - product bloat is an issue that can have longer-term effects.

I bought almost all of the 1E products over the 12+ years of its existence, and they all fit on 2 shelves. Pathfinder is only 4 years old and it already takes up 3+ shelves. IIRC, Paizo has said that demand is sufficient for the pace they are on, but for how long is the question....

 

[Imaro]

Are we talking about rules bloat or product bloat because they are two entirely different things and it seems some posters are using them interchangeably in this thread when they aren't.

EDIT: As an example... pawns and maps were cited as part of the product bloat but they add absolutely zilch to rules bloat.

 

[Starfox]

Paizo has said they actually feel obligated to do so -- and I think they are.

Because of the Open Gaming License, Pathfinder can't print a single page of rules that others cant scavenge from, put on the internet, and write their own modified version of. Which is great, and the intent of the OGL in the first place. And I think this is good for Pazio and their customers and 3rd party publishers and... well, everyone involved.

 

[DaveMage]

Are we talking about rules bloat or product bloat because they are two entirely different things and it seems some posters are using them interchangeably in this thread when they aren't.

EDIT: As an example... pawns and maps were cited as part of the product bloat but they add absolutely zilch to rules bloat.

I agree they are separate issues, but I think both issues are a concern.

 

[Imaro]

I agree they are separate issues, but I think both issues are a concern.

They are an issue for some people I guess, but I play Pathfinder and between the rules, for the most part, being freely available (which for me does have an effect on the issue) and Paizo presenting them mostly in a toolbox way... I don't see much of a problem with rules bloat. If anything I would say getting into Golarion beyond the main campaign setting is more confusing and suffers from more "bloat" than the actual rules, but that's just my opinion.

 

[ImperatorK]

The more options the better.

 

[Nikosandros]

The more options the better.

Indeed. I had issues with 3.5 because it was sometimes difficult to keep track of all the available options that were spread through several books. With all the rules for Pathfinder available online the problem, IMHO, isn't really there.

 

[Farscape]

With regards to "bloat": I never found this to be a problem because back in 3rd edition, the only books that you were supposed to count on were the big three (PHB, DMG, and MM). You didn't have to allow every single option from every single options book that existed.

If you wanted to keep your games option light, you just tell your players which books are going to be allowed whenever you approach them with your campaign proposal. Having lots of options allows me to pick and choose what I want in my campaigns and what I don't want.

It's better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.

 

[DaveMage]

With regards to "bloat": I never found this to be a problem because back in 3rd edition, the only books that you were supposed to count on were the big three (PHB, DMG, and MM). You didn't have to allow every single option from every single options book that existed.

If you wanted to keep your games option light, you just tell your players which books are going to be allowed whenever you approach them with your campaign proposal. Having lots of options allows me to pick and choose what I want in my campaigns and what I don't want.

It's better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.

But with Paizo, that's only half of the equation. If you are running a Pathfinder AP, the writers may use all of the books for their monsters/NPCs. As the GM, you then have to understand what it all does.

 

[Farscape]

But with Paizo, that's only half of the equation. If you are running a Pathfinder AP, the writers may use all of the books for their monsters/NPCs. As the GM, you then have to understand what it all does.

That's fine. What I am saying is limiting what your players have access to.