I love 4E - but I hate the 4E modules. What can be done?

[delericho]

Plot device events need to happen off screen. What is the point of having the PC's jump through these hoops to get to a location in time when the end result would have been no different if they took a lunch break and strolled over to the vault afterwards. This is the textbook example of pointless encounters. If the end results of the encounters don't matter then why play them out?

Indeed. Also, if an event must happen, then it really needs to happen off-screen. PCs have a nasty habit of doing things that break the plot, like preventing the key theft/murder, killing off a crucial NPC at a bad time, or whatever.

And if the PCs literally can't affect the outcome, then you've got a whole other mess of problems. It's railroading to some extreme - take it too far and the DM might as well just read the story he has written to the players.

(Still, could be worse. In "Expedition to the Demonweb Pits",

Spoiler

the PCs are given their mission by a key NPC of questionable character. Immediately before meeting said NPC for the first time, there is an encounter in which the PCs are directly warned not to trust this NPC. So, the entire plot is contingent on the PCs foolishly trusting an NPC they've just been warned not to trust?

)

 

[ExploderWizard]

Because it's fun?

If you find your fun in scripted encounters, Enjoy.

 

[TerraDave]

@TerraDave - That is SOOOO NOT the greatest thing I have seen.

C

 

[Scribble]

If you find your fun in scripted encounters, Enjoy.

Shrug- depends on the encounter/adventure really.

Do I want everything to be scripted? Of course not- But if something happens to be scripted that leads to more fun stuff happening, I'm fine with it... Especially if I'm none the wiser (because I didn't read the adventure I was a player in.)

Guess I don't take them as seriously? Doesn't matter so much how we get where we're going as long as it's fun along the way.

 

[JoeGKushner]

Thunderspire is an interesting approach, sort of a mini-megadungeon. I like a lot of things about it.

But it has about 22 combat encounters, almost all multi opponenet, multi room affairs. This does not include random encounters. It does have some other stuff, but a lof of the combat.

If I was still doing a weekly game I could take those 22 encounters and then flesh out with other stuff. It would be ok. Though even back then I tended to short cut modules that started to feel like fight after fight.

With less frequent play, I could still flesh it out, and just spend a really, really long time on it. I don't want to do that. I would love to be able to play in 3 longish sessions.

Then wouldn't that simply be a matter of cutting out material? It spans 3 character levels. The assumptions in 3e and 4e assume character advancement during the adventure.

As someone who played a lot of 1st and 2nd ed, once you started hitting 4th-6th level, those assumptions were dead in the water.

Surely having too much is better than having too little and having no character advancement? It should allow a much higher level of customization no?