I miss Dual Classing and the power of nostalgia

[diaglo]

dual = 2

my biggest beef is people taking 3 classes.

 

[Particle_Man]

I do regret that I never got to try out a dual-classed Assassin 13/Illusionist 14+ in *1st* edition. A "mole" in the Illusionists' guild!

That said, the "second" class would not take too long to catch up in, since you would be starting with the xp table of the second class. So if you are a fighter 9 and dual class into wizard, then when your friend the other fighter 9 becomes a fighter 10, you will have gained 250 000 xp, which should get you fairly high up in wizard levels (7? 8? 9? up there, anyhow). Meanwhile, in 3.x, the fighter 9 who multiclasses into wizard just gained 1 level of wizard (assuming no multi-class ep penalty) when his friend the fighter 9 becomes fighter 10.

Edit:If OSRIC is a reliable guide, then 250 000 experience points gets you to 10 as a Magic-User!

 

[diaglo]

dual classing.

PC spends his entire life upto the point when he goes on his first adventure training or becoming Class X.

and then in a few short adventures suddenly wants to become class Y.

um.... it takes time. or concentration. falling back on your original class means you um... broke your concentration. all those gains are lost.

whereas demihuman X. lives a long darn time. and has multiclassed. b/c they live a long darn time.

 

[tenkar]

That said, the "second" class would not take too long to catch up in, since you would be starting with the xp table of the second class. So if you are a fighter 9 and dual class into wizard, then when your friend the other fighter 9 becomes a fighter 10, you will have gained 250 000 xp, which should get you fairly high up in wizard levels (7? 8? 9? up there, anyhow). Meanwhile, in 3.x, the fighter 9 who multiclasses into wizard just gained 1 level of wizard (assuming no multi-class ep penalty) when his friend the fighter 9 becomes fighter 10.

Only one level "ding" per adventure (or was it per session?) in the old rules though, and you needed to train for those levels. Extra expo is lost if it would bring you higher then one point below the next "ding". So to catch up you'll be fairly useless to the party for the first 5-6 adventures, and still underpowered for compared to the rest of the part for even longer.

 

[WSmith]

dual classing.

PC spends his entire life upto the point when he goes on his first adventure training or becoming Class X.

and then in a few short adventures suddenly wants to become class Y.

um.... it takes time. or concentration. falling back on your original class means you um... broke your concentration. all those gains are lost.

whereas demihuman X. lives a long darn time. and has multiclassed. b/c they live a long darn time.

While we are on the topic, dialgo, since the reference in Men & Magic is very vague, how do you handle dual-classing? Do you let the character still use the abilities of the older class, or do they not have access to those abilities until the meet or exceed that level (like in AD&D) OR do they not get to use any of the abilities of the forsaken class at all after dual classing? How do you work hit dice, saves, etc.?

 

[diaglo]

While we are on the topic, dialgo, since the reference in Men & Magic is very vague, how do you handle dual-classing? Do you let the character still use the abilities of the older class, or do they not have access to those abilities until the meet or exceed that level (like in AD&D) OR do they not get to use any of the abilities of the forsaken class at all after dual classing? How do you work hit dice, saves, etc.?

case by case basis. not really. i treat it much the same way i do elves or dwarves. pick the class you want to use for that adventure. however, no exp earned for the old class if they pick the old class. you are the class you are playing. you are concentrating on using those abilities without slipping into your old mindset.

 

[FireLance]

dual classing.

PC spends his entire life upto the point when he goes on his first adventure training or becoming Class X.

and then in a few short adventures suddenly wants to become class Y.

um.... it takes time. or concentration. falling back on your original class means you um... broke your concentration. all those gains are lost.

whereas demihuman X. lives a long darn time. and has multiclassed. b/c they live a long darn time.

That argument works okay for elves, gnomes and dwarves, but falls apart completely when applied to half-orcs (who, IIRC, had shorter life spans than humans).

 

[Treebore]

Dual and multi classing weren't broke as a mechanic, it was the pre reqs and racial rules that make it goofy.

As far as being a character in a campaign, that chooses to go multi or dual class, it sucks in that you are significantly less skilled in any of your classes compared to the single class fighter, wizard, cleric, or thief.

Now if you play to high levels, say 12th and higher, its not so bad, becuase your only one or two levels behind, and your versatility really does make up for it.

So I agree that the rules, as they are written, for 1E, 2E, and 3E are not the best. But I am happy with the ones I have written for my game.

 

[Particle_Man]

Only one level "ding" per adventure (or was it per session?) in the old rules though, and you needed to train for those levels. Extra expo is lost if it would bring you higher then one point below the next "ding". So to catch up you'll be fairly useless to the party for the first 5-6 adventures, and still underpowered for compared to the rest of the part for even longer.

But even with all that, 1st/2nd ed dual class catch up leveling is still faster than you could add 10 levels of wizard onto your Fighter 9 in 3.x. And presumably at that level in 1st/2nd edition, you could get by (use-wise) on some useful magic items (wands?) for a little while until you caught up. I honestly forget whether 1st ed had training rules. I know we never used them, but maybe they were there.

 

[Ranger REG]

dual classing.

PC spends his entire life upto the point when he goes on his first adventure training or becoming Class X.

and then in a few short adventures suddenly wants to become class Y.

um.... it takes time. or concentration. falling back on your original class means you um... broke your concentration. all those gains are lost.

Of course, because humans in their short life can't multitask. So much for being the renaissance man.