I wish all publishers would go systemless.

[Geoffrey]

I greatly appreciate stuff like this:

The World Book of Khaas ( http://empcho.bizhosting.com/worldguide.html )

The Pirate's Guide to Freeport ( http://www.greenronin.com/Merchant2...ode=1001&Product_Code=grr1903&Category_Code=2 )

These products are timeless because they will never be "out of date". Further, they have no space wasted on game stats that you might not use because they are from an edition of D&D you don't play. That frees up more space for the good stuff.

I wish all the d20 publishers would go to systemless publishing rather than sticking with 3.5 edition or switching to 4th edition. If (for example) there are 6 bugbears in a room, DON'T put in their stats. Chances are a large number of people will find the stats useless. And just how hard is it to look up "bugbear" in whatever D&D bestiary you prefer? I'd much rather do that than have reams of potentially worthless stats.

 

[JoeGKushner]

Probably because the assumption of what a bugbear is changes in each system.

Heck, if you like those, check out Catalyst Games, makers of the old City Books and Grimtooth Traps among others.

Systemless books are far from new and rarely have done eye popping great. I'm glad that we've got the books we have and could always use some more.

 

[jdrakeh]

Heck, if you like those, check out Catalyst Games, makers of the old City Books and Grimtooth Traps among others.

Those books are actually a line of Flying Buffalo, Inc (i.e., Catalyst isn't a publisher but a game line). Most of them are still in print, too (and dirt cheap). As for the OP. . . yes! I agree 100% -- I would love to see all (or at least more) publishers print systemless setting resource books.

 

[Geoffrey]

Probably because the assumption of what a bugbear is changes in each system.

Exactly. In Necromancer's generally wonderful Wilderlands of High Fantasy boxed set, there is a gold dragon with nearly 1,000 hit points. That is absurd in 1st edition AD&D, in which no dragon (other than Bahamut and Tiamat) has even 100 hp, much less ten times that many. All I need to know is that the gold dragon is really big and really old. Then I can pretty much instantly make a mental translation of that into AD&D terms: a huge, ancient gold dragon with 96 hp. 2nd editioners could do the same, as could OD&Ders, B/Xers, D&D Cyclopediists, Hack Masters, C&Cers, 3rd editioners, etc. And when 4th edition comes out, the 4th editioners could do likewise.

 

[Slife]

I would rather they not. Making crunch is work. Making fluff is fun.

 

[Aus_Snow]

I would rather have the stats included, even if I have to mess with them. Which I do, always.

 

[Psion]

I do prefer stats, so long as those stats are stats I can use. Sometimes in fantasy, exotic effects and capabilities drive the story. A well written supplement will, AFAICT, necessarily have things going on that will leave you with the question of how it is handled in a game.

But statless is better value for my money that space being taken up by stats I can't use.

If it's systemless, I do like some "system neutral" stats I can use as benchmarks to decide how to scale things in my own games.

 

[TheAuldGrump]

I would rather they not. Making crunch is work. Making fluff is fun.

I might have waxed more poetically, but that is my opinion in a nutshell - if I am going to be using someone else's material it is because I don't want to go through and make all the crunch by hand, I am being lazy.

The Auld Grump

 

[Ulric]

Yep. I like systemless stuff too. I'm not against crunch.

I just think more systemless stuff would be great--more stuff I can plug into whatever system I'm using at the time.

 

[Dlsharrock]

The trouble is, with regard to publishing, that you can't win. If you make systemless, you get bad reviews and complaints from GMs who don't want the hassle of doing the crunch themselves. If you include stats you invariably appeal to only a proportion of buyers using the product and are thusly accused by the rest of wasting space/time and in the case of PDFs, printer ink with pointless stats. This makes it tricky to know which is better.

It's refreshing to hear some support for systemless product though, as that's my preference too.